Welcome to the huberman live podcast where we discuss science and science based tools for everyday life. I'm Andrew huberman. And I'm a
professor of neurobiology and Ophthalmology
at Stanford school of medicine.
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of daily, caffeine consumption.
The question reads, what is your opinion on the net benefit of daily caffeine consumption? And how can somebody determine if daily caffeine consumption is right, for
Well, first of all, I did an entire episode about caffeine. You can find that by going to huberman lab.com. At that website, you can put in caffeine into the search function and you'll find links to that episode in all the format's YouTube, Apple Spotify etcetera, and it's time-stamped. Of course, you can navigate to the particular topics, most of interest to you.
However, for sake of this discussion, I can summarize a few of the key points. The most important thing to understand is that for most adults. So that is people
about age.
Age 18 to 20 or no
older. Daily caffeine consumption is not going to be a problem provided. It does not induce anxiety
and certainly provided that not induced anxiety or panic attacks,
and provided that it does not disrupt your nighttime sleep. This is why I always recommend that if you are going to consume
caffeine in any form, coffee tea, soda, or otherwise
that you try not to ingest caffeine within the eighth and ideally
In the 10 or even 12 hours prior to bedtime. That's because the half-life of caffeine is such that even if you were able to for
instance have a cup of coffee around 3 p.m. or 4 p.m. and then
fall asleep around midnight, the architecture of the sleep that you get is going to be disrupted. For instance, it is very important that you get sufficient amounts of both slow wave deep sleep as well as rapid eye movement, sleep each night. And if you consume caffeine too close to bedtime
and here, I'm defining
Too close
as anywhere from 8 to 12 hours before going to sleep. Chances are you're not going to get as much rapid eye movement, sleep or slow wave sleep that you would otherwise and it is the amount of rapid eye movement, sleep and slow wave sleep, that together lead to whether or not, you
feel you had a good night sleep in terms of your next day alertness and cognitive
abilities. Now again, some people may find that they can drink caffeine in the late afternoon. Maybe even at night and still fall asleep. But I promise you even if you're in that category
You will
sleep far better. Meaning, the
architecture of your sleep will be better and you will feel far more rested the next day. If you abstain from caffeine within the 8 to 12 hours prior to bedtime, and I should also say that none of us are
perfect, myself included. I will sometimes have a cup of
coffee in the late afternoon and sometimes that will cause me to stay up a little bit later. Sometimes it won't. I don't think you want to
obsess, or worry too much about having
some caffeine. Every once in a while in the late afternoon, if you are still able to fall asleep,
But don't make it a regular habit.
Now, as far as we know, there is no drawback to consuming caffeine on a daily basis. Again, provided does
not disrupt your nighttime, sleep and provided that does not induce anxiety.
In fact, most of the world consumes caffeine every single day, the current estimates are that
90%. That's right. 90 90 percent of adults throughout the world, consume a caffeinated, beverage every single
day. That's a staggeringly high number making.
Fiend the most popular drug on the planet. In fact, because of the way that caffeine
works and just to remind you how it works. It
effectively blocks, adenosine receptors adenosine is a molecule that
builds up in your brain and body
more and more.
According to how long you've been awake, it makes you feel sleepy,
caffeine blocks the adenosine receptor. And then when it is dislodged from that receptor, whatever adenosine has built up and is around. Can then bind to the
adenosine receptor and makes
You feel very sleepy, that's the caffeine crash. So if ninety percent of the adult population of the planet, Earth is consuming caffeine everyday. That means 90 percent of the adult population of planet. Earth is blocking their adenosine receptors for some portion of their daily life. And then their adenosine is binding to the vacant receptor. Once the caffeine has
dislodged and why are 90 percent of adult humans consuming caffeine every day?
Well to feel more energized, more focused to have
Or both cognitive energy and
physical energy. Now, of course, most
people are not walking around thinking, oh caffeine gives me more energy, more Focus etcetera. Most people are consuming caffeine every single day and are consuming caffeine every single day. In order to feel quote-unquote normal to be at their Baseline level of cognitive
ability, and physical energy. And so on.
In fact, if you look at the data on caffeine consumption, what you'll find is that caffeine actually
Is a cognitive enhancer can improve learning and memory. It can increase physical energy, it can increase, mental and physical stamina, but a feature of those studies, that's not often discussed, but that was, however, discussed
in the full episode on caffeine,
is that studies have caffeine typically are done by taking chronic caffeine users and then having them
abstain from caffeine for some period of time.
Usually, four days to two weeks in which time they undergo caffeine
withdrawal, they do not feel well.
Get foggy, headed, they have less energy. There's some malays. Sometimes, even some mild depression.
And then what they do is they have people take
caffeine and take a cognitive exam or do some physical activity and compare their performance to what it was when they were in the withdrawal State,
another typical form of study on caffeine is to take people who are naive to caffeine or who never
take caffeine and then have them, ingest caffeine and then measure their cognitive and/or, physical
performance. And in both cases, you see improvements.
It's what I'm saying here is that daily caffeine consumption is not going to lead to improvements in cognitive ability or improvements in physical ability. Above one's Baseline, unless you either abstain from caffeine for some period of time, typically four days to two weeks, prior, or you are not somebody who typically ingest caffeine. In other words, ninety percent of the world's population is drinking caffeine on a daily basis to be at their normal
level of mental and physical.
So, the question was, is there a net benefit to daily caffeine consumption? And here I can reliably say, provided you don't suffer from anxiety attacks, or lack of sleep. From the caffeine
consumption provided that you're mindful of not ingesting caffeine too late in the day. There doesn't seem to be any big drawback to drinking caffeine on a daily basis. However, there doesn't seem to be any great benefit at least in terms of Direct effects on cognitive or physical ability. Okay? So I realize this is a little bit of a
Convoluted answer. But we have to be honest with one. Another here caffeine is a performance enhancing drug but only when compared to the non-caffeinated state and ninety percent of the adult population in the world is caffeinated so adding more caffeine above what you would normally consume is certainly not going to allow you to think better and perform better. Physically, here's a useful way to think about caffeine. Most people can pretty well tolerate doses of caffeine anywhere from 100 milligrams to 300 milligrams.
Depends on body weight and depends on your tolerance
tolerance, of course, based on how familiar you are with the effects of caffeine. And how regularly you consume
it, a typical cup of coffee, which by the way, does not exist. Depending on the vendor, depending on how much water to Coffee ratio. One uses, depending on whether or not it's french press, or its pour over the type of coffee, Etc. All of that is going to determine the total amount of
caffeine in that
coffee. But we can set some outer bounds on the total amount of
caffeine that likely exist in a cup of coffee, and it's probably somewhere.
Are between 100 mg that would be on the weaker side for a six or eight ounce cup of coffee out to about 300 milligrams for the equivalent 6 to 8 ounces of
coffee. But if you were to brew your coffee, very, very strong or like me. Occasionally, throw shot of espresso in there too. You
could get that number up to 400 or 500 milligrams of caffeine.
I personally, tolerate caffeine pretty well, I've been drinking caffeine since I was a teenager mostly in the form of brood unflavored yerba mate. Tea, it's important to stay away from the smoke varieties of yerba mate. If you're going
to get your caffeine from your butt,
To the smoked varieties can be carcinogenic, the non smoked varieties. Don't seem to have that property
but there's a lot of caffeine in yerba mate. So I'll drink yerba mate and have for many many years. Or I'll drink black coffee
or espresso or espresso Americano things of that sort. That's my preferred source of
caffeine. Most people are drinking coffee to get their caffeine and I would say that if you are going to drink your caffeine, drink it in the early part of the day. As I mentioned earlier, I am a big proponent of delaying, your first caffeine
intake.
Until at least 90 minutes after waking in order to avoid the afternoon crash. I've talked a lot about this on the podcast there, a lot of Clips on the internet, explaining, the rationale behind that. And if you do experience an afternoon crash in energy, I do recommend delaying your morning caffeine intake, to 90 to 120 minutes after waking.
Now, for people that want to get more of a true cognitive enhancing, and performance enhancing effect from caffeine. Again, you're going to have to
abstain from caffeine for about four days,
for regular caffeine drinkers, that's going to be
Difficult, right? That is going to
lead to headaches, that's going to lead to brain fog. That's
going to lead to feelings of malaise.
In fact, the last time I took four days
off or even a week off from caffeine consumption was when I was sick. I don't get sick very often but when I am sick, I generally abstain from caffeine and
sometimes I wonder whether or not the malaise I feel from
whatever, you know, viral or bacterial thing, I might be dealing with when I'm sick is in part the malaise of caffeine withdrawal I certainly noticed I feel much better when I returned to drinking caffeine.
I mean, but that tends to coincide with feeling relief from whatever sinus symptoms and other symptoms of might have been experiencing from the illness. So it's not a good experiment, I can't tease apart those variables.
So the short answer is for most adults there does not
seem to be any major downside to consuming
caffeine and there have been scattered reports here and there in humans showing that ingesting caffeine can increase dopamine
receptors which will effectively allow you to get more out of the dopamine that you produce. This is why caffeine has a
Elevating as well as energy elevating effect. I should point out that some people just cannot tolerate caffeine. It makes them too jittery too anxious. They start sweating. They get heart palpitations. It's very hard for
these people to build up a tolerance to caffeine that allows them to enjoy it. These are the people
that can even feel a fluttering of the heart, and a lot of energy lift from decaf coffee,
you know, something that to me is just a foreign concept, but some people are just that sensitive to caffeine that even the small amounts of caffeine and chocolate or decaf coffee.
Make them feel to alert and they should
abstain from caffeine. I don't think they are in any way, harming their
health by abstaining from caffeine.
Then there's the issue of Children and adolescents, and teenagers and young
adults, ingesting, caffeine.
And I covered some of this in the episode about caffeine but there's been a lot of debate as to whether or not caffeine can cause osteoporosis whether or not can Leach calcium out of the bones whether or not can stunt growth. Frankly, there's not a lot of evidence for those sorts of claims and yet,
Helping brain is a very tender and malleable
environment and somebody who
started off his career as a developmental
neurobiologist studying developmental brain plasticity and
wiring, it does sort of make me cringe to think about children younger than the age of say, 14 ingesting, large amounts of caffeine in any
form, soda, coffee tea, Etc.
Despite the fact that there's very little evidence that it can stunt their growth. I don't personally like the idea of the young brain being bathed in an
adenosine receptor antagonist.
Genus, which is effectively what caffeine is know as much as possible. One wants the developing brain to develop in a milieu
of unencumbered non chemically
encumbered interactions between neurotransmitters and their receptors. Unless, of course, there's a clinical need for prescription drug or a supplement or some modification of a nutritional program
specifically to up or down, regulate the dopamine
system or up or down, regulate, the serotonin system. But those are the sorts of decisions that really should be made.
It close oversight and recommendations by a psychiatrist. So the short answer around daily caffeine consumption in young people, meaning, 14, and younger
is avoid it. If you
can have your children, avoid caffeine if they can, the
occasional bit of
caffeine, is probably not going to be a problem. The amount of caffeine in small amounts of chocolate, probably not going to be a problem, but
caffeine in the form of energy drinks sodas coffee tea
for children younger than 14. Just seems like a bad idea from everything.
We understand about brain wiring and the trajectories of brains that develop with a lot of chemical adjustment from other sources, like
caffeine now for kids, aged 15 to say eighteen or Twenty a lot of brain wiring is still occurring but a lot of it has been completed. So probably not as
risky to consume caffeine every once in a while or maybe even on a daily
basis. But there are two I think there are great advantages to limiting the amount of caffeine that one
ingests and of course in the
In ten years nowadays a lot of kids are consuming energy drinks and
soda and some of those energy drinks. And so does contain a lot of
caffeine anywhere from 200 to 800 milligrams of caffeine and
nowadays more sodas and energy drinks, contain other things like amino
acid, precursors to neuromodulators like dopamine. So for instance a lot of energy drinks now
contain l-tyrosine which is a precursor to dopamine. A lot of them will contain theanine. I've talked about theanine as a supplement that can promote more
restful sleep. If taken 30 to 60 minutes,
Before sleep. The reason
why a lot of energy drinks and sodas
and frankly now coffee brands are including theanine in the coffee or energy drink
or soda, is because it tends to have a mild anxiety reducing effect
and it reduces the Jitters that caffeine
creates. And so that's actually a trick that these companies are using in order to get people to ingest more caffeine because by including the theanine it's preventing the kid or
adult from feeling too jittery and therefore
They can continue to consume that drink without feeling like, they're over stimulated. So if
I were to take the parental neuroscientist adult voice here and I would say, avoid caffeine intake as much as you can until
you're about 18 years old but I'm realistic. I realized that adolescents and teens aged say, you know 14 or 15 out to 18 and older are going to be consuming caffeine in the form of energy drinks and so does, but reducing the total amount of caffeine that one is
Ingesting in those years. It just seems really advantageous. Again for all the same reasons I mentioned earlier, you don't want the young brain bathing in a bunch of exoticness meaning externally introduced neurochemicals or in things like theanine or l-tyrosine.
If you're going to
indulge in
caffeine or in energy, drinks, or thinning or l-tyrosine for that matter, that's the sort of thing that probably is best
left for people, 18, and older,
and even there if one finds that caffeine is for them as do I, I think,
Always best to try and get your caffeine from a clean source of clean Source. Meaning,
something that contains just coffee or just tea. Again, this isn't a knock on energy drinks
specifically, but you really have to make sure that whatever energy drink you're going
to consume, you know, what's in it? You recognize what the different ingredients do and you
recognize the potential of ingesting
those ingredients chronically over and over again. And I've
talked a little bit about this on previous podcast and I'll get into this
again. Maybe we'll do an entire episode about energy drinks because
They
are so
commonly consumed. Nowadays now getting back to the original question about daily caffeine consumption.
This person goes on to say that for them. Okay, this is their personal experience. After a few weeks of consumption of daily caffeine. The - start to outweigh the positive ones, they're getting poor quality sleep, lack of appetite anxiety, Etc. And when they don't consume caffeine, they find it a lot easier to be mindful and their meditation practice is much better, but they're lethargic and less motivated. Okay, so what they're describing are all the
classic symptoms of caffeine
Peruse, probably not abuse in this case, although caffeine can be truly abused people. Taking caffeine pills,
Etc, in large quantities. We're not talking about that, but this person is describing the classic pattern of overuse of caffeine and the classic
pattern of withdrawal from caffeine when they stop taking it.
So what should somebody
like this do? And I think
that's an important question to answer
because I think a lot of people fall into this category,
they drink caffeine every day, they're no longer getting the performance enhancing effect of caffeine to there.
Taking it just to
be normal or feel like they can focus normally and have normal amounts of
energy. But then if they try and come off, they feel worse. There are a couple ways to do this. You can taper your caffeine intake off over the course of four to seven days, but most people don't have the
discipline or don't want to spend the time doing that. But if you want to, the way you would do that, as you would cut it by about 10 or 15 percent per day. You do that by volume, or you could do that by concentration of
coffee, that sort of thing, a simpler way to go about all this. That still will allow you to get some
The performance enhancing effects of caffeine, and yet experienced far less
withdrawal would be
two things. First of all, just have your amount of caffeine
intake for two or three days. So again, that could be by volume or it could be by concentration, probably easiest to do by volume. And so instead of drinking an 8 oz coffee in the morning, maybe you do four ounces of regular coffee. Four ounces of D cap, or you just have the four ounces of coffee. You do
that for three or four days and then you take
Hap's one full day off from caffeine may be another full day off. You're going to feel a lot less
bad on those. Two days having cut your caffeine intake in half in the previous four days, then you would if you just went cold turkey and then you go back to ingesting
caffeine. But you go back to ingesting caffeine at that 50 percent dose or what used to represent that 50% dose of caffeine for you and you just continue that way on a daily basis. And then every once in awhile, when you want the performance enhancing effects of caffeine, you go back.
What was your original dose? Which is now double what you're taking on a, on a daily
basis. So what we're really talking about here is not going cold turkey, we're not talking about quitting caffeine in definitely what we're talking about is cutting the amount of caffeine that you drink in half
for about four days, okay? Plus or minus a day and then taking two days off from caffeine completely and then going back on that half dose of caffeine in definitely that's your new Baseline of caffeine intake and then every
once in a while,
Well if you need a bit more of a
lift, you ingest twice as much caffeine or a coffee that's twice as concentrated. We should acknowledge that. Most people aren't going to be
really precise about the amount of valances and the amount of caffeine nonetheless it's pretty straightforward to know that you're reducing your caffeine intake. Certainly is clear
to know if you're adjusting no caffeine for a couple of
days and it's pretty clear when you're doubling the amount of caffeine but you don't have to worry so much that you're
exactly doubling the amount of caffeine you can drink one and a half times as much as you happen to drink on the day before or
you could drink.
Three times as much, you would definitely feel it if you drink three times as much. One very important thing to recognize is that on any day where you really spike your
caffeine intake above Baseline. No matter where that Baseline is when you start could be zero, could be 400, mg can be 200 mg.
When you double that intake, you will get a big boost of energy and the next day you're going to
feel the crash from that you're going to feel more lethargic. You're going to feel not so good. This has to do with dopamine receptor modulation. This has to do with adenosine
After modulation, the important thing to do is not continue to consume that elevated level of caffeine, which is what most people do, and then they set a new higher Baseline just to feel normal. The key thing is to just
manage to get through
that crash, day managed to get through that one day, where you feel a little less good or maybe even down a bit, get outside a bit, get some more Sunshine. We know that spikes your cortisol in a good way, right? It can increase the catecholamines, dopamine
etcetera, get a little bit more sunlight, get a little bit more movement, get outside, do something to offset those feelings.
Delays and then get right back to your
original goal. Level of caffeine each day,
there's no use in getting. So
quantitative that you make your life, miserable measuring things out like a laboratory chemist, if you're
that type and you want to do that, be my guest. But unless you're taking caffeine in pill form, it's very, very
hard to get extremely exact about the amounts of caffeine that you're ingesting. So it
is okay to eyeball it, but understand the Contour of how caffeine works. And what the
caffeine performance
enhancing effect comes from, it comes from a caffeine intake above
Baseline understand that any time you
go above Baseline with your caffeine intake, there's the potential of some anxiety. Understand that there's going to be a slight withdrawal. Effect lasts about 24 to 48 hours, battle through that short period. And you'll be right back where you
started and where you
need to be. So you can enjoy caffeine on a daily basis and derive the benefits because there are
many benefits to drinking caffeine and avoiding some of
the potential hazards. And again, if you're a young person, I recommend delaying that caffeine intake.
Maybe, I don't know, 10 years, thank you for joining for the beginning of this. Ask me anything
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