What's up, everyone? This is Anthony Pompeo. Know most of you know, me as pomp. You're listening to the pump podcast, simply the best podcast out there. Now, let's kick this thing off.
Dave Rubin is a political commentator, YouTube personality and talk show host. He's the Creator and host of the Rubin report, a political
talk show on YouTube and the network Blaze TV.
Dave, is also the co-founder of locals a new Subscription Service built for creators. In this conversation, we discuss critical thinking skills or eroding Trust.
In
institutions censorship decentralization
owning your audience, first principles, personal
responsibility of democracy and capitalism.
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All right, let's get this episode with Dave. I hope you guys enjoy this
one. Anthony pumping. Ah, no runs
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All right, guys. Bang bang. I've got Dave here, ready,
pop them in Miami in Florida. A free City and a free state. I'm very excited. Are you going to move here eventually? Well, we've just moved my company down here. We move the locals here, I'm thinking about it. I sat down with my business managers and I know you know, a little something about dollars and cents and they basically looked at me and were like, you're an idiot for living in Los Angeles and I'm
In effect, we crunch the numbers I could live for free. You know what I mean? Like my every no matter what I bought here, I would in essence be living for free. I'm a little, you know, the humidity, the my hair's a little lower here. I got to do, like, just the tighter cut, like you, then I would be. All right, that's that's the main thing, keep it? No, I I have to get here at some point, like, what is going on in Miami is just extraordinary. Yeah, just like, literally, you sent out a tweet, something about locals and then the mayor tweeted at me and now I'm here to interview him tomorrow, like that's so the reverse
It's of the bananas bullshit that I'm living through in La, where I hate the mayor and hate the governor. So it's like,
yeah, I think I gotta get that. Maybe the governor's, like, breaking the law in
California. I want that man in jail, that Gavin Newsom is an evil. Disney cartoon villain, who should be in jail to just, I mean, I know, you know, but like the French Laundry thing alone should have taken him
down. All right, so let's just start with a topic that I know that we've talked about before, which is politicians for the most part, have this like immunity to criminal charges.
Is or the legal system. There is social pressure which we saw some of that happen over the last year or so, but the actual like checks and balances of our democracy that are supposed to hold people accountable for doing things that are legal versus not legal, they just don't apply. If you are in certain political offices and so like, let's just start, is that? Like just a perfect example of how the whole system screwed
up. Yeah. That's a great place to start.
Because basically what you're saying is nothing works anymore. And that's, we're kind of in The Show. Must Go On version of democracy at this point. Like everyone knows it's not working, but we got to keep pretending. It's working because otherwise we'd really have to look in the mirror and be like, what, what are we right now is it what Marcie? Well, I would say were basically a somewhat functioning democracy at some level at this point. But it's very tenuous right now. Like there are so many things that are upside down right now. Like, like it could basically turn like this
Like they could pack the courts, they could change the Electoral College. These are not things that I'm making up. These are things that they're saying that. The lefties basically are saying they want to do and then it's like the game really is over on top of the fact of all the stuff that you're always talking about relative to finances and everything else. It's like, does anyone really trust that these things make sense that your money is insured, that the banks aren't just going to collapse like it all feels kind of crazy right now. And what sucks is we don't have trusted voices.
Like how many people when you wake up in the morning and you're scrolling Twitter like usually and these you follow people by choice but usually I'm like man that guy's an idiot in. This is a moron that's a sellout and this is a grifter and it's like it's really hard to find people that are basically trustworthy. I'm not saying they get everything right, but just like ballpark estimate of like where we're at, where we've been where we're going. It's really, I'm trying to be that for some people and I think I have been but it doesn't mean I'm right all the time, but we've lost that trusted group, it's just almost completely
done. I think that there's
Three groups of people that are trusted in the sense of, if they're good at what they do, there's a reason why they're trusted, one is macro hedge fund investors. All they think about all day. Long is risk? Yeah. And they think about complex systems and then they wager money. If they're right. They make money if they're wrong, they lose money. It's the ultimate skin
and they cannot get bailed out one way or another so that some of them are sure.
But for those folks,
There's this natural sense of you can't bullshit the actual asset going up or down. It's going to do it with or without you. And therefore for the most part your money being wagered. You have to think a certain way, right? You have to seek
truth. There's basically some sense of reality there. Yes, can't just make up the whole thing, right? Yes, yeah. The
second group is what I will call the Silicon Valley, Outcast. And so, what I mean by that is
Also Kemal investors not also can valued Founders. Actually think some of them are the worst offenders of a lot of this stuff, but the folks that are well respected in Silicon Valley. Yep. But definitely are a little kind of. Yeah, they're they're kind of out there. Like I don't know if I want to do deals with them, you know? One let's take like a Founder son. Yeah, heretic. Khan was a conference that they were gonna put on. Yes, I
was. I was at one of the meetings, discussing look at gonna happen. They're like
those people obviously aren't very worried about what other people think about them.
Yeah, they're here to take a path. That is not well, warn ya. So I think they'll like there's like a lot of those guys but seeking. Well, they're seeking of Truth. Yeah. Right. You may agree with him to screw them wonderful, like they're trying to head in the direction. I think that that's it. And the third one is like what I'll call like pure Independence. And one of the one of the people that recently has gone from and maybe it was I wasn't paying attention before. Hmm, and now just, I have been or I don't know why Glenn Greenwald feels like he came out of nowhere.
Are from, I'm a journalist to like I've taken every weapon out, and I am ready for battle every day. Yeah, he's going after people that doing also, I'm kind of reading them like the
guy's not wrong. Well, I will Pat myself on the back a little bit here which by saying he's kind of repeating a lot of the stuff that I was saying, okay we're years ago from from a political perspective because I was a lefty to so Glenn. If you think a Glenn he's like a traditional Lefty. He and I think what does that mean? Well he's a lefty in that. He
If you look well, it's all right. So first off I would say, we shouldn't look at things left and right anymore, you should look at things as sort of top bottom that you should look at them as you know, you're either for centralized power or decentralized power. Okay? So, that would be the basic thing, but in a traditional sense, Lefty meaning, you're a Democrat, you believe, the government should and can do certain things or you're more of a conservative or Republican and you basically believe the government's not supposed to do a lot, don't tread on me, low taxes, states rights, things like that. So he definitely comes from more of like
decentralized.
Chronic, that's right. So he comes
from that world. Okay, I come from that world to then I woke up very publicly over the last couple years, that's kind of what put me on the map and he was sort of staying in that spot. And then I think what happened and the re and this is where I think you woke up to him was Trump and what he realized was and I think a lot of lefties realize this is that Trump was not this evil right-wing crazy monster that they made him out to be in many respects. He was doing a lot.
Out of the things that we all Wanted. Let's get us out of Wars. Let's not pay countries to do things that often work against our interest interest. Let's get rid of Regulation, let's try to get the economy going. So a lot of economic populist that we're on the left started liking Trump. So I think, and then what, for Glenn that I think really cut close to him was to watch people that pretend that they're journalists but they're actually journalists to watch them basically all day long nitpick, every little sentence with Trump and
Take all the reverse positions they used to. That's really what I think. Like blew it up for him and then and then he really has gone in that direction. But we've seen a lot of people in our world kind of go in that direction. Since we're, I would say, they're now in effect, I would say they're Libertarians, basically, they're old-school liberals at some level but really, two minutes, your Walker conservative is sort of what I would say at this point. Doesn't mean you're conservative, like, in the way we all think of like a traditional conservative. Like, I think I know most of your political views, but like, I don't like off the top of my head. I don't know if you're a pro.
A choice or knowledge, but I would say you're conservative. Either way in a certain sense, like nobody really wants to hear that because the word is kind of scary and then people think you're mean or something like that. But that's what it is. If you want to, if you want America to continue in some way if you respect freedom and individual choice and any of those things I would say in essence, you're welcome
capitalism. It's individualism it is personal responsibility raised. He's done right hot, very scary ideas. We should actually stop talking. Yeah. What was it for you? That kind of woke you up.
Terms of when you talk about like being a Democrat, I think that's one of the things that most people they use is like the the mudslinging against people who have views that you are. I may have they would say, oh, you've always been that way like your the hardcore, right? But you
actually like a Bernie supporter. I was yeah, Bernie you can see videos. I'm not proud of them, but you can see videos of me and like 2015. I agree with Bernie on everything. And the thing is with the lefties and the progressives have done this really well. Everything they say, kinda sounds right, unless you think about it.
For two seconds. Like if you don't sound right in that initial thing, like $15, minimum wage, well, of course it sounds right. Like yes, we want poor people or people on the lower end of the economic class to make more money that sounds right. But then there's no economic theory behind that. You can't just artificially tell businesses that they have to pay people this much blah, blah blah. And then of course you just picking a number. So why not 20, why not 30 by the way? Rashida Talib, you know, one of the progressives in the house she's pushing for 20 and sometimes $25 and it's like, well yeah wine I guess she's more.
Moral than old
Bernie. Well the government is just going to print it also then the business owners only have to pay it
they'll print it also. That's the other thing that they do I'll get back to the questions that but they print it all and then at the same time, they always want to raise taxes. So then what's the purpose of raising taxes? Other two, otherwise than punishing people? You know what I mean? If they believe they can just print print print print well then why would you need to be raising taxes? Unless you're actually trying to punish The Producers at the same
time my favorite statistic and all of the government conversation politics
Economic cetera. 2011, I think Rose 2009 came over, but since 2009 and 2011, the US federal government has taken in more federal income tax every single year than the year prior. So for a decade, every year, they've collected, right? They've made more money from a revenue standpoint, at the exact same time, every single year. The inter year deficit has widened.
That is not a nice anything gotten, right? It's not that
So that's the first part. That's what lefties never want to hear about that. It's not an income problem. Oh, if we just gave them more education, we need just more money for teachers. It's like no because if any of that ever worked then education would be getting better. But it does anyone in California like boy, we really have a great public education over here, but to answer your question directly, there were a couple moments that really let us starkly. And I think for a lot of left these you need to be like literally like basically hit in the head with a frying pan to realize what's going on because it's so
So it's so much part of your ethos. Like if you just if you grow up in America from a cultural perspective, you're a lefty, right? Like it's like, Democrats are good. Liberals are nice. Republicans are mean and care about money and War, so you really have to be like whacked with something. So one one moment was I, when did you get whacked? When did I got wakeley? I got whacked a couple times, but one of them, I'll give you was, I was on air with The Young Turks and their far-left Progressive Network. When I was one of them and they're playing a video of this guy, David Webb. Do you know David? What do not so serious.
Them host, conservative these, Fox News guy also, he's a conservative who happens to be black, okay? So you can already see where this is going and they're watching, they're playing a clip of him and they're calling him an Uncle Tom and a self-hating black man and you know just all of the worst stuff you could possibly say about somebody. What they didn't know was I had a show years before on Sirius XM and I used to see David in the hallway and I would go on his show. I was a lefty, he was on the right, we battle it out and then we go downstairs to do frescoes and
have steak and have whiskey and have a great time. We became great friends, he's still a good friend of mine to this day and I'm sitting there watching them. And I'm thinking, wait a minute, wait a minute, I know David Webb. I know this is a good man. I know he believes what he believes he fights for what he believes. He's, he's put himself out there, it's not easy to say I'm a black conservative. It's like saying, I'm a gay conservative or whatever else. And here you have the so-called tolerant people saying all the worst things you can possibly say about a black man and they're doing it in the name of Tolerance, you know, to me in there. Oh, you bleep
Man, you don't behave the way we want black people to behave. You're a bad guy and suddenly in that moment because I knew him it wasn't just like a guy I was seeing on a TV
cuz it's fair to call my friend. Yeah, he's a very good friend of mine but
so here I have, they're saying all the worst things in the world about a friend of mine who I know is forthright and honest and then it hit me. It was like you guys call everybody else racist. But you are the racist. Because what is racism? Prejudice prejudge. Well, they see a black man and by the color
That black man skin they think? Oh black man must think these things, black man allowed to think these things and I literally remember looking at them like looking at my other panelists. And and it hit me I was like, these are the racist and then once you realize that, that they're looking at the world through a prism that is that it's very, very backwards, pretty much the rest falls apart. So that's the beauty of the red pill thing. If you can get someone to have their red pill moment, whatever it is the others. You only need to have one red pill moment. The other that some people
Right? So some people after I told, I told Candace Owens I told Canada's own. She like crushed it up and snort it and then she was gone. Like she was a lefty, she snorted and then bam. She's like supporting Trump like that. That's not how most people do it. Most people. It's like a slow release little time release kind of thing and it can literally take years. But once the process starts, it started. It's like Neo in The Matrix like he didn't want to see it. The second he saw it, but once you see it, it affects absolutely everything in your
life. That was Moment. One, what was the next major one that you remember?
Member. So there were, there were two others. I'll give you one other which, which actually happened right before. But this was the one that like fully that started the process. So, I probably should have done this one first. I was watching Real Time with Bill Maher. And did you ever see this? There's a very famous episode when Sam Harris was on with Ben Affleck and they were talking about radical Islam. Do you remember this? Okay, so basic you live in a world
that I don't exactly understand that. Well, so I'm going to get an education. They
go. No, we're both going to get an education. So
So Sam was on the show, you know, when Bill does a show he does the panel. So there's three people on the other side and they're doing like hot topics and then you know he does like a protected interview at the end of the show where it's just you and Bill, right? So Sam was on that side of the table. So it was really supposed to just be Sam and Bill going back and forth. Bill Maher. Biggest Lefty liberal, in America for the last 20 years and Sam Harris who I didn't even know who he was at a time. But this mild-mannered, you know, nice suit, very soft-spoken, neuroscientist talking about inner peace. He was on a book tour for a book called
waking up a guide to spirituality without religion. So this was not someone that was coming on the show to fight with people. Anyways, Bill obviously not a fan of religion, right? And Sam is like sort of the most well-known atheist in America. They start talking about religion and and Ben Affleck who was about to do Batman for the first time and he was very jacked up. I don't know if it was all natural. Just saying he was like huffing and puffing and red in the face. They started talking about Islam and basically Sam said that you should be allowed to criticize any set of ideas but you
Want to be bigoted towards people and we all know this to be true. Of course, you could criticize the platform of the Republican party. That doesn't mean you hate all Republicans, right?
Separate the person from the idea,
simple as that. So you could criticize the Old Testament, it doesn't mean you hate all Jews. And in this case, Sam was saying, well you should be able to criticize the ideas of the Quran but you don't want to be bigoted towards Muslims everyone gets that. It's, it's such a it's ever. I can't say everyone gets it. Obviously everyone doesn't get it, but but it's a fundamental if you want to be like a truly honest,
Person in the world. It's a fundamental thing that you must understand Affleck went bananas on the two of them in the line that blew up was he said to Bill Maher, into Sam Harris, your gross and racist and he was screaming and huffing and puffing and pounding the table and suddenly. So I should have told you this story first because when you talk about that wake up moment, the next day. Basically, so I'm watching this and I'm going whoa this this gets to what I've been trying to piece together you know when you're thinking something for a long time and then something happens and then like the Legos come together and that's what it was.
Like, because I was like, this is what the progressives do with everybody. They keep telling you that decent people Bill Maher. No one in their right. Mind thinks Bill Maher's are racist. You can think whatever you want about Bill Maher. I don't think anyone honestly thinks he's a racist and here's this neuroscientist talking about, you know, inner peace. But suddenly Bill Maher, in effect Affleck thinks he has the right to just call them racist without think about what it would be like in a conversation. If you just met somebody like he would take a while before you told them that they were racist, right. But like with
Two minutes. He sits down there races and then what I watch happen over the next couple days suddenly everybody, huffpo Vox, all the Lefty things, suddenly all these articles Bill Maher's are racist, Ben Affleck called Bill Maher races. He's a racist Sam. Harris is a racist and once I saw that, I realized how the framing was completely backwards. There's a set of people who are trying to talk about, extremely difficult things, you could argue that, that might be the most difficult because you're talking about religion, you're talking about Islam, terrorism. All these things that might be the most thing hard thing to talk.
And there's a sliver of people trying to talk about it. Honestly and what is your reward from the lefties? The reward is your racist. Now I'll just say one other thing on that which is that Bill Maher who has been the standard bearer of the left 420, almost 30 years in America at this point, you know, he was doing Politically Incorrect before that people on the right, like Bill Maher. Now, people on the left hate Bill Maher. Why? Because he defends free speech, he defends free speech. So people on the right basically you're like Bill Maher. You're a lefty, you don't really get it.
We disagree with you on abortion. We disagree with you on taxes, blah, blah blah, but you defend free speech. And that's so important to us that basically people on the right, if you say to the average conservative, what do you think about Bill Maher? They'll be like I, you know, he's okay. I disagree with him on some stuff but he's okay. You asked the average like Lefty foot soldier MSNBC person what they think about Bill Maher. He's a racist. And and that fundamental disconnect is, is soaked. Its so intertwined with what's wrong with the left right now.
Is there like a
All Viewpoint, right? Like I think it's amazing and this is me. Coming from somebody who I understand very little about politics, I like to think nobody get first principles, which is more important, maybe I, that would be a kind thing to say to me. But
politics is a game. You get the philosophy behind ya which I think
is. And so it to me, it's like there's the labels and like, all this kind of stuff. And if you kind of strip all that away, it feels like okay, you have two groups of people. They have different views about all these different topics.
But naturally, it's like almost like a bell curve. Yeah. Is there some people in the middle who are just like, you know what? Like I think a I'm still super strong about it, right? Like I'm like I'm like an extremist in that and by the way, if you show me some information and data and I might change my mind a little bit and like move a little bit more, you know, as the left or the right or whatever, but like that Central piece, it almost feels like that's like either disappeared or just like, like, nope. I'm not gonna be like, I'm gonna shut the hell up and I'm getting out of here. Yeah, well that's like partly opened, that's
partly a function of. So,
Media because if you're in the center, let's say well then you're going to get hit from both sides and that's nobody would neither one of the
extremes like the center because they're not on their side
because it's like, well at this point I would say as I defined things before where you're sort of woke or conservative, I would say the center. The center is if you think that the constitution is decent, that the founding of America, I'm doing this all from an American perspective. Let's say, If you think the founding of America was good, if you think individual rights are good, if you think rule of law is good, the Bill of Rights are good that we have god-given, right? So the government didn't give
Us, right? It can protect them. And then whether we agree on marginal tax, rates or the estate tax, or the wealth tax, or even abortion, or any of those other things are irrelevant. So that's the fight right now. So, I would say, most almost everybody except that, the except the antifa foot soldiers, that are literally burning down cities, and then the journalists on MSNBC and CNN, and then sort of the big Tech oligarchs that can figure out ways to pit us against each other. That's the woke thing and that, you know, and then there's like an academic version.
Obviously, there's a lot of brainwashing at colleges, most of us are the first thing most of us are just like Live and Let Live. This place is pretty good. It ain't perfect. We can acknowledge that. We can always make it better, but I don't want your stuff. I'm not entitled. Like, most people really understand that most people are rational actors, rational self-interest, but, I mean, that really, most people are decent. I fundamentally believe that, but I don't believe that the machine is decent and what the left you seem to believe.
If we could just give the machine enough power if Bernie could just have enough power or now, Biden, if we, if he could just take more from some people. If we could just fix all these things in the history that he never fixed. I mean, Biden's been in politics for 47 years. He did, he never mentioned systemic racism before. Now it's his life's cause it's like, come on. So you either believe that humans are imperfect creatures and that we can just deal with the mess and that you're going to figure out your life. The best way, you know how. And I'm just not entitled to your stuff.
If you make a lot of money more than me, maybe I can look at that as the star, that I want to get to, if that's important to me, or you believe that a bunch of imperfect creatures can create a perfect system, and that's what these people are doing. I mean, this, this is Marxism. They basically want a whole bunch of flawed people. We're all flawed to create a system that if you just behave within that system, if you just act as a cog in that system, you'll get you'll be alone nothing. And you'll be happy. That's like the meme out
there. But going back. Yeah, those rules. Don't apply to them. No, never
Sighs. Tough
course. Yep. And I mean look at the leader of black lives matter who bought a house in Topanga Canyon in Los Angeles which is 99.7 percent white now. I don't care about any of that stuff. She's the one that purports to but she's bought bought something like 4 million dollars worth of real estate in the last couple years it's like this is the greatest grift going of all time. Have they sent any young black people to colleges have they built any institutions? No, they're just here to tear everything down that, that's the fundamental difference.
I think, Liberty minded people or individualist minded, people want to build things, and if you want to build things that's hard, you know about that, you know, it is hard work to build a company, to build institutions to build places of Higher Learning. Notice they don't do any of that, what they're really good at is America's horrible, we're going to destroy the whole thing. There was a beautiful moment in the, in the democratic debate early on before everybody dropped out, and they all got behind the guy with dementia. I think we'll get to that a little
A bit. But there was a beautiful moment where mayor Pete turned to Bernie and he said Bernie you want to burn it all down. I don't that was actually the one true moment in the whole thing that's what they're here to do. We could all do that. We could all set fire to something but to build something is way harder.
When you think about kind of this whole thing, right? And it is economic it is political, it is kind of cultural asset, you know.
There's all these different elements to it. Is there one point where you say, like if we could fix this one element, the rest of the system would kind of self correct. Is it the media? Is it the economist is? It literally the politicians? Is it the education system? Or is it? No, this is a complex system and like there is no one place to kind of
solve if you that's probably right. That's probably it's a complex system in a country of 350 million.
People that is an idea. A Dennis Prager talks about this. A lot that the beauty of America is that it's this idea that people can come from all over the world with whatever their Traditions are their food, their their family structures. All of those things, you can come here and America says, hey go for it. We're not going to get in your way. Go for we're going to treat you all equally. That's the thing. They're trying to undo right now, but I would say the system because you got 350 million people with all sorts of different beliefs and backgrounds and all that. To me, the best system is one that just gets the freakin hell out of the way.
Exactly what we set up I guess probably the most sensible answer. The question would be that, it would be education if young people were actually taught, like, good decent principles that we probably were you grew up in Jersey, right? North Carolina, and North Carolina. Okay, wait, I thought you were a jersey guy.
My entire family is your old Tri-State are okay. But right, so my dad and mom ran away in the right role in North Carolina.
All right. So, but all right, so I grew up New York and most of my family lives.
Ginger Zee public schools and there were good decent Public Schools. It doesn't mean they did everything right but you got like some sort of sense of like a robust education. All that the schools have been so like can you imagine having sending your kids to a public school right now to be taught that boys have vaginas and girls have penises and that if they're white they're automatically racist and that the history of the country, didn't the country didn't start in 1776. It started in 1619 and that the prime the Primacy of everything of the country was driven by racism and slavery.
I mean, you'd be sending your basically sending your kids to a brainwashing institution. So I guess fixing education will be number one. I think that's long gone. I think the ship has freaking sailed the teachers unions are so deeply corrupt. They have been infected by the woke virus, they're gone. I think maybe the other answer would be. Yeah. If we had a decent media, if we had imagined, there was just 10 people in the media like mainstreamers. So I'm not talking about somebody that maybe woke up recently like Glenn Greenwald, I'm talking about if we could turn on
A channel and reincarnate, Walter Cronkite and maybe he wasn't that great and we've just sort of canonized him now. But imagine if there was like a couple people in America that you really felt, boy, you're really getting some honest. True assessment of what's going on here. That would help a lot because otherwise, the fraying that we have right now is just going to keep going, but I just don't know. It's, it's a good question because it's like, is this thing just too big? Probably is like, it's too big to fail in some way but now it's too big to succeed.
The woke virus as you described it. The woke - we've talked about in the past, I've example, after example, of virtue signaling element of it right where people basically are saying one thing when given the opportunity to do something with money or time or whatever. They don't follow through with what you would like other people's money. Yeah, that is one way to put it. Yeah.
Is this just a natural evolution of a society? Like yeah, you kind of Ascend to the global superpower. You one right? Like you're the top. Everyone gets fat and happy complacent. Yep. And then rather than stay on guard and and be worried about what comes next. You basically just turn inward and all the fat you know, rich people also are screaming at each other about. Oh you know, give me your food, give me your plate. You know, you almost imagine like ancient Rome. Yeah.
Yeah, like The Fat Guys laying around like, just trying to like, yell and scream at each other and then eventually like, rain Rome Falls?
Yeah. That well, I'll absolutely think, that's right. The analogy, I was always giving related to Trump was that Trump was the guy guarding the gate at the castle and all of the elites instead of being like, maybe we should help that guy, he they were actually mocking him and trying to take him out. They were basically like trying to cut his Achilles heel, while The Barbarians were at the gate and in this case The Barbarians, I mean the woke stirs. The a'ight the people that have
Decided that this thing that we are a part of is not good. Notice nobody leaves, right? Nobody leaves America. Everyone's still. If we open, if we fully opened up our borders, the way they would like, we would be overrun overnight. Anyone can leave America where no one's going, but the craziest most bananas Carl Reiner. You know, any just pick any of these left. The Hollywood people. They never leave. They never lie, why? Because it's pretty freaking spectacular here, and they would never make the money they make or live the life, they make. Any
We are geographically great and they know it's good. They're making money off very confused people. So I think they're basically you add all of the elites just mocking, the guy who was guarding the gate and yes, it's that we got fat on freedom, we got, it's been so good here for so long. The levels of freedom and wealth that we've done for everybody is so extraordinary, and is the jealousy. The world over that wheat, aren't you?
Yeah you're right. We turned it on ourselves. We were suddenly like oh is any of this good and then you know you couple that with just with really bad education, as we've talked about before and everything else and then it's like yeah. Now the system is just like it's just kind of hanging on and you know to me it's like there that we had a real chance. It's very odd for me. I did not support Trump until September of 2012. 2019. No 2020 was the election. So 2020 and
Now, it's
like so you were extant. Just sucks. I don't know
this. So I would anti-trump. I voted for Gary Johnson in 2016. Okay, you know, the libertarian Gary doesn't he was not a great candidate.
That's the Aleppo
Aleppo. Aleppo was. And, and just like he wanted the baker to bake the cake, which made no sense from a Libertarian perspective. He and he was also just I've hung out with the guy actually and he's been on my show, he's a nice guy. Like, I'd like to smoke weed with him and go skiing. That's what he really wants to do, but instead he pretends, he's a politician.
Titian. So I voted for him, and then I had three years of, really, like the red peeling process and really at the end of it, it was like, well then I might have to like, kind of suck it up and be like, yeah, that guy who talks funny who's a bit of a dick and a troll. And yeah, maybe he is the only thing that the system could choke out, that's what I kind of came to on trump. It was like it wasn't that he was this great Statesman that we all would have wanted, right? Like I would much prefer that we have a true Statesman like get me JFK again but that doesn't exist a broken system.
System can only give you broken people in a way and Trump was just like, I'll do it. I don't want to do it but I'll do it. But if you want to watch something interesting on YouTube, go and watch Trump interviews in the 80s with Oprah when she's begging him to run for president and he's on Donahue, he's saying the exact same
things not just Netflix does not look special. What is there? There's a Netflix, these called the American dream and he's 33 years old or 32 years old and he's in his office and a reporter basically.
He is like, you know, you can run for president one day if you listen to it and you didn't see him, you would have thought he was 75 years old saying the same thing. I mean, it's almost to a tee. Yeah,
exactly. It's nose keeps saying the same stuff, he's not as orange. She's not his Gruff. His the way he speaks is a little bit different, you know. Now it's Lynn
blew my mind by the way. Like it like it was no, it was shocking. Because I was like, oh my God. Like this. I didn't know that. Like I'm not old enough to have understood that like that. Literally here is a video.
Wow, does he say the line in that?
Does he say, line, while I want other people to do it first? He's okay. Because every time that I heard him say it in the 80s, when I watch these videos, he always says the same thing, which is while he's like, well I wish somebody else will do it. Like I hoped I hope I don't want to do it and that to me is the what you'd want out of the president, you'd want somebody that would be like I really don't want to rule the world but if everything else is so messed up than, maybe it takes like this, crooked New York City, you know, Builder, I mean to be a builder in New
Like City, like you're gonna have to do some shady stuff but maybe that was the only
chance so put some aside for a sec. Yeah. And I want to come back to the presidential Futures that we have but my favorite episode I've ever had on the podcast, is somebody DM me on Twitter and he said hey man, I'm a regular dude. You don't know me. No reason why you ever will know me. I like to come on your podcast and talk about why I like Bitcoin. I probably got that message a hundred times over. Yeah, there's never even responded any of them. For some reason, just
Then in may just said, respond responded. I said great, why did you come on the podcast tomorrow or two days from now we did a remote interview and afterwards. He tells me that he literally was so nervous that he got his wife to take their kids and their dog meat. Like get the hell out of the house, and he likes put this whole thing set up and headlamps and like he was into it, right?
It's my favorite interview because he said, one sentence to me that is like, seared in my brain. He said, look, man, he's a, he did a tile and flooring in Canada. I don't want to rule the world. I just want to create a better life for my family, that's it. And I just always think, like, that is majority of the population. Yeah, there are psychos who want to rule the world. But majority of people do not give a shit about other people or other things, or whatever. They're just saying if I can create a better life for my family, be happy and spend time with people, I love
Great life. That's it. That's how you find purpose and meaning and everything else. Right? Like, think about it right now. I'm I don't know. I met them on the street but like, I don't know what my neighbor thinks about anything. Basically, he could be a communist. You think they normally do? You think they probably know what? I think, which, I can always tell when they know, because then I people, well, before covid people used to cross the street. Now I know why they're cross the street. But usually, when people see me that almost all we were just at West down before we walked in here guy, came right up to me like it's funny because on Twitter people are horrible because and
Anonymity and all that people in real life. Super nice. No one has ever come up to me and said anything negative. I'll get I'll get some mean, looks but no one has ever, and I hope you're not going with that continues. But don't worry. Become a
brother who we can change that.
That's, he's got this studio on the street over here, but, but in essence, I don't know what my neighbor does, what they believe in any of that stuff. And I don't care as long as the toxic goo of whatever they're doing, doesn't leak into my property as long.
As they're not doing anything to affect my life, that's the beauty of
America and do whatever you want, as long as you don't hurt anybody.
Yeah. I mean, that in essence, that's most Libertarian approach to everything or like, you know, some way, it's a very like an cap approach that there's just no interference in anything. I'm not fully there on all that. I think we need some basic guard rails, you know, like it's just you need some reality but that's that's it. So when you again, when you ask about that Center thing and like what most we are but good, people are afraid to say that think how many people you probably know
In your own life, who are just afraid to say that because the woke have trick them into thinking. If you don't say, your woke or post a black picture on Instagram, or a virtue signal that you were at some rally even though you don't know why they're there. I love those videos where they send interviewers in and they're like, who died and why are you here and they're like what? Well you know like all of that nonsense but yes most people are Live and Let Live. I firmly firmly believe
that when I have dinner in private with people I always like to ask one of two questions. One.
Not going to talk about because one of time but the second one I want to talk to you about. First question, I always ask is what's the one thing you believe that you would feel is Politically Incorrect, the same public. You get a whole plethora of answers from climate change, stuff to political stuff, to literally, you know, sexual preference. I'm all kinds of crazy. Yeah. Right. Like, that's just a great thing because they like, you really understand who somebody is and probably think whatever. The second question, I like to ask because it's just pure friggin entertainment and my wife always just rolled her eyes and say, who's the?
Craziest most unassuming future president that you could see but who's the person that you think could be president? Yeah. That other people like that's nuts. And I've always said to people and then I want to hear your. Yeah. The first is the rock. Yeah. I genuinely believe, yeah, the rock is gonna be the present United States. He's charismatic, he's intelligent, he's funny. There's a bunch of studies that show the most physically kind of dominant person. If you put them up on stage, like, people just vote little a supposed to be the leader.
And I used to joke that, you know, Trump's like a big guy six for whatever right here sitting next to Dwayne Johnson and he said some stupid Dwayne Johnson. Aha. Shut your candy ass up. Yeah, would laugh and like oh you just very quickly see like he could navigate his way to become the president popularity contest. The second person which now people are these guys crazy Kim Kardashian,
Super recognizable. Many people think she's attractive. She has a very, very high degree of expertise in transitioning from. Let's call it a sex tape stage to reality star 2. Now Criminal Justice Reform and lawyer to maybe Governor to present, like you could see a path where somebody is actually very intelligent. You listen to like the David Letterman interview she does on Netflix, you'll say you're like
That's not what the media has portrayed her. As like, she's actually very, very intelligent and then you add in all these other things around Fame, and popularity, and culture Etc. And you start to realize like, oh, is it just me a popularity contest? Yeah, because it literally just going to come down to like who runs the high school like student-body President campaign, a hand out lollipops. Write it like this. Like they will be
handing out. Ubi is what they'll be handing out. It's not
going is that? Is that like yeah we determine president moving forward. Just like who's the most popular? Who's the biggest social media following they win?
Probably, yes, right. Like I that's probable but that's the best argument for limited government that there possibly is that that whatever happens. So whether it's the rock or Kim Kardashian, or who would, you're asleep or the ghost of Gary Coleman, whatever it is, it's like, whatever it is, that it won't affect you that much. So, who that? That's a good
question. I mean, like, who's the person that is the most out of left field but you still believed they could become
president? Well, this isn't out of left field at all but I honestly believe that Candis Owens.
President really? Yeah,
yeah, okay, explain. Because I think that will surprise a lot of
people. Well, first off she's been, you know, she was a lefty, she then, you know, she went all the way from left to Trump supporter. As I said, she snorted that thing and then bam she was off the rental of all red pill, red pill Ball. But yeah, and she she's absolutely clear about her opinion. She's completely Fearless, she has fought the machine. She never lets the machine beat her. She fights and fights and fights, it's extraordinary. I also know her very well. She, this is a great human being like,
She really is a great who me her tactics are a little different than mine, you know. I mean, we always talk about that. Like sometimes I don't even do it as much anymore, but I used to try to win more with candy than always be on the attack. I'm on the attack more now than I used to because I think there's just not a lot of ways to get these people related to decency in logic and all that kind of stuff. I think she's just prepared and and but I guess that's not a de left field. You want you want a delivery, filled
by someone who's not involved in
politics may be like
Matthew McConaughey like he's kind of waking up now. He did a couple shows B, Jordan Pederson, he understands like purpose. He's really into purpose and
hums a little bit pounds his chest. Yeah, there's and everyone's, like, I seen the righty Whispers, he
went to whatever he didn't Interstellar. I just watch that again the other day, like, like something like, you know, but again, that's just the celebrity thing.
Yeah. But but there's substance there.
Oh yeah. No, no, there's absolutely substance are but it but it's unfortunate because if you go back, I mean literally if you say
Say this is like the nerdiest thing I could possibly tell you. But if you looked at them like books and literature that I have in my bathroom like when I'm reading on the toilet I have like tons of like founding documents from the United States and what these people with Jefferson was writing to Adams. And all these things, you read these things like literally spend, two minutes. Glancing through one of these things. You will think my God. These people were so much better than us. They were so for, as much as I like Trump, as I said he was just necessary at that time. He has nothing on these guys. Like they're
Standing about what the world was, what? Freedom was, what believing in things outside of yourself, bigger than you allowing people to do what they want next door to you. Like, so it's like, we need those people back, but our system and Twitter, and algorithms, and gotcha, and a dishonest media, none of that adds up to a good decent learned man. Becoming president of the United
States. I always think about, it's a sad thought.
But I talked to a friend about all time, I do not have any of my smartest friends who want to go to be a teacher, or a politician, not one of my smartest friends, even remotely has
considered it. Yeah, that tells you all you need
to know and I'm like, man, what are you guys going to do technology or Wall Street?
Well, that's kind of beautiful, actually. So let's take the good version. Okay. So the good version of it is that the good people that, you know, like the most thoughtful, interesting probably creative. They're going to do stuff, right? Like that.
Stead of teaching about it and you know, I'm not fully saying this but you know, the old adage is those who can't do teach. So the people that you're talking about they're going to go build these things. That's what's so cool about Miami right now. It's like literally I got off the plane, I could like feel it, it felt real to me. I was like, whoa, there's something going on here. It's happening here. You know, that's exciting and awesome. And it also breeds more of it, you know, I mean there's a little bravery there and then you see all of this new stuff happening and then other people are like, wait, there's something new there. I want to go some fight. It
feels like the new land
Bingo. It's the wild west that who say it's
Like they're actually finding what you guys are doing here. And what I now think we're doing by bringing locals here is we are now finding the Undiscovered Country and let's let's build it together. It's awesome. And by together, I mean, we're going to build it individually and then see how that she's being kind of kind of gets bundled. But so that's the good version of it. That those people probably did great things, the bad version is yes. Then you will only get these broken corrupt bankrupt morally or, or financially. So, they're doing it.
Money, you know how many politicians going with very average Lifestyles and go out with Mega Millions? Way too many of them. We just won't get. Look, I've had a ton of people beg me to run for governor of California, because I've been so outspoken about the recall.
That's a baby. That looks like a maybe
that I wouldn't say zero, but the state is so freaking corrupt that the idea that you could do anything is,
how would you do it? But how would I get us more about that? All right, so that's Mark Cuban before.
Were in prison. How did he do it? Yeah, need a fascinating answer and to his credit it was a thoughtful answer given that he probably hadn't spent that much time thinking about it, but like, if you sat down and said, okay, I have to run for governor. Like how do you
win? Well, I would, I mean, I've that I've thought about it, okay, which would be that I would take $0 other than fundraising, for whatever. The absolute minimum would be to be on all the ballots. So just I just want to be on all about, I'd I would do. Nope, mainstream press period, I will not go on MSNBC Ella, not go on CNN. I can't say, I wouldn't go on Fox actually.
They've actually been very good to me. They let me go on and say whatever I want even when it's counter to the say, Conservative, Republican narrative, but I would not play with those children that have just completely wrecked media. I have a show, I have a voice, I would, I would talk to YouTubers, I would go on podcasts, and I would say, here's what I want to do to fix California. We're going to lower taxes for everybody 25%. Tomorrow, we're cutting the budget by 40% tomorrow. Sorry, sorry. Like these things don't work. You know what's happening in California right now because we have the
Recall. So Newsome, who is an evil, Disney cartoon character villain. This is a horrible human being, he suddenly getting rid of the homeless people, there suddenly disappearing. I don't know what he's doing to them, but where I live under the underpass has been a freaking massive, like, you almost have to, like, actually a city. You have to admire the Ingenuity of these people. I'm like, you guys are building like three level tents. Like this is impressive, but it's been there for like a year last week suddenly God and I'm noticing now, around parts of LA it's starting to disappear because he knows he has a about a three
Month window before the recall election to fully clean the place up. So everyone forgets. So he's just truly evil. But I would say why the reason I don't want to do it is because of what you just laid out. I want to build awesome things. I love talking about the ideas that we're talking about here. I love the fact that I'm in the tech world now which I never never expected this. And now I spend probably it's probably more than half my day, doing locals related things and talking to people about all the solutions whether there are technological or
Oil or legal or whatever it might be, and I love that. So I feel like I'm a productive member of society. Why would I be Governor? Like they're going to call me at 3:00 a.m. be like Governor Ruben. There was a earthquake in Santa Barbara and it's like, all right, you know, call me in the morning. Like, what do you want me to do? So that would be a horrible
government-wide. Be like somebody should do
something about that, but but that also is part of it. If you're really a thriving person in this world, right? Like I consider myself a thriving person, not a perfect person.
I consider myself a thriving person. Why would you want to be in government? Why would I want to be in the thing that's there to control people? Which, by the way, that's why you get horrible people in government. They can't really so Andrew Yang. I think is a really interesting one because he sort of loved in our circles and I was think it's really bizarre. It's like, why aren't you doing more than, why aren't you building Great Tech and great things? Why do you keep wanting to go into government? It doesn't really make sense to me. Like, you know, you failed presidential bid, then you went to Georgia because you wanted to help the Democrats win. Which I
Guess did happen or it did happen? Now you're running for mayor, doesn't look like that's going to happen. I guess after this, he's going to run again. It's like you seem like the tie all the tech people seem to like you or yeah. I don't really like him either. I can sort of read your
eye. I just think, how did you get our hype? I think it's all right. Go ahead, I have a story. He also
threw me under the bus in the New York Times. Okay? So you don't like them. Well, because bit the the questioner asked said, why do you go on these right wing shows like like the Dave Rubin show which isn't even a show that's not the name of my show.
Where he raped the quote was where he regularly hosts white supremacist and not only did Yang not push back on that, but he basically was like, well if the lefties would be nicer, I wouldn't have to do shows like that and I was like, what's your policy on cursing? The dude, I was basically like fuck, you man, like that's that's such why people think you're just a cardboard nothing because like you beg, not know, I can't see beg me, do my show, he wanted to do my show, I was thrilled to have him. I treated him with the same respect. I treat
Anybody else. And now a New York Times person, basically calls me a white supremacist and you kind of, you know, you don't say no, it's just gross. It's alright.
So here's my
money that I could read it from you just buy like yeah, your eyebrow basically was
like, well here's why I don't know him. Yeah. So I have to care about that. I've never had a one-on-one conversation with. Yeah. It's like in all these situations, I'm always like, I know it wasn't the best thing ever would be that you could sit down with each candidate have an hour-long meal with them and then walk away by car this one. But like, you know,
Tulsi gabbard I did that with her on the show.
I freaking loved her and we both got good friends and she's an honest. Good woman before
yang
said he was running for president. I happen to go to a conference that he spoke at
I was very off, put to the point of like,
I was like, man, that guy, something doesn't make sense what we can at the conference. I think I was at the conference or maybe, right after the conference. He knows he's running for president. And I learned there were being like, what? Like, like that can't be
real, what was it? That he was saying that?
It wasn't even like a specific thought, like a specific idea of like, hey I'm going to do this or I'm going to do this, whatever it was. Just this idea of like man, that is commentary on somebody who is talking about.
Topic he hasn't done the topic. I
totally agree and it was
just a very, very weird feeling. You just you can tell it's like when you listen to a professor talked about like economic policy and you're like man you have never wager of money in the market because let me tell you that anyone you would be broke. Yeah. Like you'd be bankrupt already. Yeah. And, and for whatever reason, I don't know why. Well, I guess I actually think that he's like, seems got really personal people. People love them like all of a sudden, like I feel bad even saying any of this.
Yes. But for whatever reason that was my experience, I could be a hundred percent off. I'm wrong all the time about people. But like, in that one moment, I remember thinking to myself, like there's zero shot and then when I like saw, you know, 6 months, 12 months later, whatever it was. And like, how far he arranges, like two years before the, the actual election. This had happened. Yeah, I'ma be like, whoa, he got really far and along the way. Like I think the machine worked against them and like, the whole Yang blackout like, yeah, it would all the complaints as to why he probably didn't do as well as he could have
done. But then he needed
Fight it you know to mean like if
he never talked about it. Yeah. So like but just like that. I think was the closest that I got to talking to one of the candidates. Yeah. And I remember being like, wow, it's like you got that far even though the machine was working against you like, huh? Okay. Your data point, right?
So it's interesting because what you're saying actually totally like puzzle pieces with what I said, I mean, it's sort of the same thing. Like it was sort of with him. It was just like there's no there there. And I actually it's interesting to me because I
I really don't. I go out of my way on my show, not to talk about people other than politicians or media members, I don't find like the average pundit or just like guy on the street to like be railing on. But yes, I'll make fun of AOC and I'll make fun of Biden and whatever. But it's interesting because yeah, it's like I saw all my kind of tech friends and my media. People, everyone loved him and I was like, I'm always careful with this though. Because see it your it because it was their way of just saying I'm not voting for Trump. That's what it was. It was basically.
All the, all the decent remaining liberals. Like the non woke liberals, who all knew that Trump wasn't as bad and for seat and I'll freaking a lot of them voted for Trump privately. A lot of them. I'm talking public people like a lot of them did and I just didn't want to do that. I didn't feel that. I could lie to my audience in that way, but I think they saw Yang as like, all right. He's not an insane. Democrat. Like so I'll just pretend I'm doing that. And then when Yang went out, then they,
All just sort of backed by and whatever
it was. Yeah, so at the media? Yeah. Which gives you have, no opinions. Yeah. It feels like I'm literally to the framework that I've used in the past. I usually talk about the financial media. Yeah, that's where I spend most my time but I'm interested if this is how the political media works as well. So
great on those shows, by the way, I've seen you on a bunch of those shows. And you know,
I
I grew up with four brothers and he's
talking like that all the time. Like, that's like that's it, that really is it. I can see it. When you have like a good line ready to drop and you know, you have a good line.
And yeah, it's like, okay, so you're gonna break three or four people or you're gonna like go on a top of wrong, and are you? Yeah. Okay. That's basically what I did up my entire life growing up and my brothers by the way they like watching the like oh my God. Yeah that one thing, like this is a complete joke that this is like, literally on television. We were gonna watch this. But the framework that I use is so there's journalists people who don't real journalism.
Quickly, you put them in that category. They write unbiased Lee as best as a human can do. They talk to sources? They actively pursue the truth and they're doing journalism. Yeah, you can say that maybe they're not perfect or whatever but like they're doing journalism their journalists and this weird to me,
not many of those,
not many of them but that's what they're that. That's the bucket you put the. Yeah.
Then there is on the Other Extreme I called Market. Participants. So in finance, these are people who are investors who are founders or whoever they are, actively participating in the market and they everything from blogs to podcasts like these other things. They're very clearly not journalists and they say, look, the reason why I'm talking about this is customers all day doing this. I put my time and effort or I put Capital at risk, and I win or lose and their skin in the game for what I'm doing.
And then, there's the middle group. In the middle group, I call the bloggers masquerading as journalists. They are highly biased. Yeah, they don't even hide it. Like, if you go to some of these websites, its opinion pieces that are literally written as articles, like, they're like, they're like, where is the opinion component of this? Try the New York Times and so, on this one, I want this one. I want to hear and then the other piece that's fascinating to me about this is when you look at the, the content itself. So there's the process.
Of which the content gets written. So if I just sit down every morning and I tried my personal opinion about something my analysis, I'm not a journalist right, like I am a talking head, I'm an opinion writer on it, by the way, that's fine but the problem with that is if you're wrong over and over and over and over again, there's no punishment because you don't get fired and you didn't lose any money. So like you basically just can keep bullshitting over and over and over. Yeah. But
The content is literally just a regurgitation of the state talking. Please. It is like I mean if you go back and you read like throughout the entire pandemic, it was like we should give everyone money. All of the Wall Street firms are bad people. We shouldn't help them, but we should have all the poor people and the debt won't matter. There we know inflation and like, just go, go, go, go, help. The people. I can't believe in helping the people, and now, it's like, well, time out everyone who has any money in any intelligence,
It was like you can't print trillions of dollars and not get inflation and I've always transitory or even worse. They just Gaslight know like, we knew it was going to be transitory of here. Like what planet are we living
on? But by the way, they do that with everything. So I love the fact that you're talking about her from the financial World, which is not totally my world. But the thing that you see is the same thing that I see coming from where the political okay. And it's the same thing that I think people see from the say scientific world or from any discipline. So like, it's like foul
He is now kind of like, oh, we always sort of were saying that maybe it was a lab leak. I'm not telling you it's a lab leak. I'm saying that we should, at least be allowed to talk about it and suddenly, you know, it's like Jon Stewart now. Mentioned it on call there the other night. So now all the good liberals who were trying to get everybody banned from Twitter. Who when Trump said this a year ago, you know, he's a racist then he's, you know, trying to get Chinese people killed or whatever, it's like, well now the liberal leader said it. So now they're all out to say. So
John Stewart said it on the show as
lime whole bear, he basically was
Like yeah, could be a lab leak and he and by the way him doing that on Colbert, that's the system if you like when we talk about, like, whatever the system is, I don't know how to exactly my
favorite question asked me was like, who runs the system, right? So nobody knows, nobody knows but but when you think
about what is the sis. Yeah, the system is Jon Stewart, who's basically been MIA for years. There's been a lot of things to talk. He was in his attic couple you and Joe Rogan. Yeah. Right exactly literally, but the system having jot trotting out, Jon Stewart, the sort of good guide media.
Liberal, you know, more young, people get their news from The Daily Show than anywhere else was just a meme of nonsense. But like the media loves this guy. Him going on, Colbert to say, the lab leak. Hypothesis is possible. It's at least worthy of being talked about. That's the
system a year. Or before somebody got banned from Toys-R-Us, Zero Hedge got banned from Twitter, he's got banned from Twitter. Trump
literally said it and they called him a racist and said he was insane, but that's the system. So I don't know who's running that. So who's running that I do the agents that put the thing like
It's not the agent so it's like I don't know. We can keep going up to some crazy
Florida sane and this is
really the airlock. That's my point. It's the airlock. Yeah. Is
it fair to say though that you're separating out Jon Stewart from again, the idea that a year ago? You could you could not say things now, you can say things and because they're different groups saying those things and it's a year apart. Also we treat it completely
different. Yeah. Because because in essence, what happens there is a parent. You know, it seems like in the last say, month, the lab leak hypothesis.
Gaining so much traction online that the system that has to be like, okay, we have to, we can't ignore this anymore, by the way,
kicked off YouTube now for talking about lab leaks, or is
that I know, I think no. Now, we're okay, not only. No, we're okay. But Facebook will now allow you to do it. They
were a year ago. There was no I literally would tell guests like time out. We can't talk about this
stuff. You know, I might show this is slight sidebar, but on my show for the first time ever we had to edit for Content. I've interviewed. I don't know, thousands of people never once edited for Content, well one time because I guess coming so drunk and stoned.
On that. We had to get rid of about half the interview because I thought it was just going to ruin their career. But a few weeks ago, I had David Horowitz on he is, he was the original sort of why I left the left guy. That's sort of what I got out of his. Now, this is a guy, he's 83 years old. Okay, son is, is Ben
Horowitz. Oh, okay, sorry, yeah. Audience would have been weird audience and
his dad was the why I left I left. I was it was a communist as a kid. Anyway, when real being re-elected and his parents were marxists when Reagan was being re-elected, he was
But decided that he wanted to support Reagan and then basically his whole life since then has been the left, trying to destroy him. He's really, really fascinating guy. Anyway
then Horace, by the way is absolutely fascinating because he
Sits at the intersection of so many different religion race technology industry now, is Dad politics like yeah. Fascinating, every time I learn more about him, he was like, I've always I've
actually only talk to him once, he's obviously a fascinating guy, but his stories. Dad, in essence on my show. A few weeks ago, said he said his own personal opinion about the results of the election and I let people say what they want on my show and we had to we blurred it where we bleeped it, and we put the full thing on locals, but I knew my YouTube channel could have
Taking out just like that really. That's, you know, we can get into Tech and censorship censorship and all that. But in essence, what I think happened with Jon Stewart was the thing was bubbling up so much online. And by the way, this is exactly what's going to happen with buying and dementia because now it's everyone's talking about it except mainstream media and they can't hide it much longer. So then what happens is the system has to basically be like, all right, we have to normalize this. Now we can't hide it anymore, too. Many people know. So then oh, why don't we bring out John Stewart, The Trusted name in America, who hasn't had an opinion on anything and all
In four years since leaving the show, let's bring him out. He'll say it, then all the conspiracy theorist and the right-wing crazy people. They were actually all. Crediting John, they were like, oh, that's so nice to hear now. The problem is that John won't make the full like the full. I get there. You got to
leave the Democrat. You know. Dirty you know the joke now. Right. What conspiracy? Theorists are just too early. Yeah
that's it. We're all just three my like Alex Jones looking pretty good these days which had kept our which
honestly God right? So take Jesus Christ.
Take all of the people that are like the actual hardcore conspiracy. Yeah the people who are on Twitter saying stupid stuff. Yeah. Right. Like I'm talking about people who legitimately you would put in the category of conspiracy theorist.
I'll go out on a limb and I will say, although most of us wish it wasn't true.
They're more right than we originally gave them all credit for which is
scary it because he goes to everything. We're talking about here that the media cannot be trusted anymore that the institutions can't be trusted that big Tech is doing big Tech is manipulating Us in ways. We cannot imagine. It's not just the ways you and I are fairly versed in Tech. It's like it's not just the ways that they can manipulate us through searches and D boosting and Shadow Banning. I'm worried about the things. We can't even think of that they can do to us. You know what I mean? The way that that if you have one political opinion, the way that
Could just force feed, you other videos to just change your opinion on anything like we're basically on this Mass. We're in this Mass dystopian experiment right now. But long story short, I think they basically try to Jon Stewart out there because it was like, we can't hide this anymore. Let's legitimize it now. Because now there must be something to it. And this is exactly what's going to happen with buying. And did you see
When all this was happening, there was a suit Anonymous report on covid. They got put out, you see this? So Roger, I'm not gonna remember all the details so already, I'm wrong, right? But a conspiracy theory, basically a group of people, I don't think it was one person, but don't think it was necessarily a hundred people, right? But a group of people got together, they did not put their names on, there's a pseudonymous thing and it wasn't a Google Document, but it was like,
Sort of collaborative software that they used. They basically wrote a report and this was widely shared in the Tech Community specifically a lot of folks who spent their time as investors or Founders. Like in the early part, they were trying to figure out data and I choked like over the last year I didn't realize how many virologist. How many epidemiologist? How many economists, you know, you know, political voter legal experts? I had in my feed right? That like, yeah.
Also, modules are popping up. Yeah, but this report literally the try one of the best things that I read and it was all written in using suit Anonymous names. And what fascinated me was. They did it to protect themselves, but it was very obvious. These were intelligent people. I'm sure was a hundred percent, right? I'm sure there was errors, whatever, but given the information they had at the time, they wrote a very compelling piece and they touch on everything from like here's how big it could get like all the things you would want to read and like understand.
Rain and I start to think more and more and more. You've mentioned a couple times at the machine working against people, people who are on the left, want to go more to the right, people on the right, you know, the everyday person or Elites or whatever, and it just feels like a blasi srinivasan. So, like student animus economy. I've been thinking a lot of this world but that's where we're headed because people are literally just going to be. So fearful of like anything I say with my name on it is literally going to be used against me
later. So the irony is, I did a video a year ago when my book came out, we release
It that day for Prager, you called The Bravery deficit and that's what we have in the country. We just have a bravery deficit. The way these that a bravery deaf or is it in essence? Is that not enough? People are just willing to say what they think. That's the way we defeat this thing if you wanted woken has to be blown out of the water tomorrow. Like it would literally just all it would take would be enough. People just lying in the sand. This is this is who I am. This is I'm going to fight for the things, I believe in, by the way, we're starting to see a little bit of it more. You know, you keep seeing these videos of like these angry mom's going to school board.
And yelling. You're telling my five-year-old, boy that he's a girl and that he's racist like no more of this bullshit. So, more and more people are getting brave because we're seeing that the machine, the machine can't destroy all of us. It preys on the fact that the fear keeps us all sort of just docile and absent. But I think the so we have to just get, oh, if we can get over the fear thing, we will defeat that. And then wait, what was the question? Exactly. Well, with just
as the student animus economy, like grows
So it's going to be out of that fear of people, put in any month,
right? So, look, there's great arguments to be made both ways here. I completely get why people are anonymous online. You don't want it, they don't go for your job. They're going to go for your family, we've allowed for political violence. Now, in the streets of America like I fully get it on the other hand, the fact that so many people are on anonymous online constantly encourages, the worst behavior possible. So if I was to ever, I actually don't look at my Twitter mentions any more, I look at the verified.
But I don't look at the just regular ones and that kind of sucks because it used to be fun. But then I think you have a version of this too when you get to a certain amount of followers, the bots in the
trolls and just the how do you respond to every single person? Oh God not anymore. Yeah, not
even want to stay sane but but what happens is if you on the rare occasion that I do actually can click. There's a way you can click through even if you're hiding them and see them. What I notice is virtually, every one that says the horrible shit that
They're saying to me all day long that I don't see they're all Anonymous. So you've incentivized, horrible behavior and then you have. So I was think it's hilarious when I see people in our world that are like, really well-known phds and doctors and lawyers and, you know, Tech leaders and they're arguing with Anonymous people all day long. It's like, if you want to spend time arguing online, then at least argue with non-anonymous people. So that there's some, some
level of. So, you know, some look em in the eye when you are young like a little bit right? A little bit. But on the
other hand
Get up, that's not me going. After the people that for legitimate reasons that are just decent Americans or forget Americans that are just decent, human beings that feel they need that. So we are going to have to figure out this pseudo Anonymous. Like are we all he? Did you ever see Scanner Darkly? Yeah, it's a Philip K dick story. It was a movie with Keanu Reeves and it's like an animated movie with Keanu Reeves and couple of people where basically, we're all walking around with these masks on all the time. And then we don't know.
Who's who, at any given time and we can all be anybody. And we're all nobody thought of that kind of stuff. And there's two really great movie actually. But yes, we're that's also what the next part of the internet's going to have to figure out because there's too many burner accounts. There's too many ways to do horrible things to many ways to coordinate assault on websites and Destroy book reviews and just drive people freaking crazy. You know what I mean? If the people that hate Bitcoin just want to say we're going to frickin attack pump every, maybe they're doing this all the time. They probably are. We're every time.
Tweets, we just have it set in some program and then we have a bunch of losers that were paying a dollar whatever and we're just going to blow up his feed every freaking day till we just break this guy
because they do it. They do it all timing, right? Don't read it. Nice that up, so that
you've gotten to the point where you're like, all right, it's not going to affect me. I know what I'm doing but you also have very thick skin. You got a thick skin and also like did any of this make us more social, you know, it's called social media. It actually made us far more antisocial and, and hateful and distrustful.
Why I'm so proud of what we did with locals, because I opened my locals account, it's freaking love in there, it is, love and good, and decent. And I think it's the promise of what social media was supposed to be. I'm not telling you, it's all perfect. And again, I don't believe in perfect systems but like something that is happening in the way we are. All communicating on Twitter and Facebook and YouTube is just wrong. And by the way, that's why I never call for regulating them because the second you freaking regulate, these things, you solidify, their existence in the system forever. Well, and the regulation makes it worse.
It's a little crush
competition. Yeah, I don't think people understand that and there's someone close to me. Who always says, the people who do the canceling will stop when they get cancelled. Yeah, right. Like, it's like, it's all fun and games until somebody turns it on you. Well, that's why
you see that's always the best. When you see these lefties, who have, I don't want to make everything about politics. But when you see these people that have spent their lives trying to destroy everybody, who they disagree with, by calling them bigots and races and everything, and make them make it so that they can't get jobs and we're going to ruin your public.
You know, personal your public life and everything else and then it suddenly turns on them. And it's like and then sometimes I'm like at maybe this one does seem on just, maybe I should defend them and I'm like, you know, we only have like a certain a certain amount of ammo.
There's all these problems, you went independent. When
the idea of well, it was a, it was a couple steps go independent. So I left a few networks, I originally left, The Young Turks then I was on Aura TV, which was a digital Network, then I left there. And I was on patreon and I was kind of the first
First of the politics guys, to be on page one it was mostly Gamers and anime people. And I the reason I wanted to leave or a TV it was a digital Network founded by my friend and Mentor Larry King. The reason I wanted to leave was because our show is blowing up and in essence, I think you'll really like the story actually, because we were like Larry King, Larry King
live Larry King. Larry King live.
We were becoming bigger than the network. So we were crushing it. And what was happening was they were taking resources from our show in essence to support things that weren't working.
Ooh, and they were constantly asking us to hit bigger and bigger metrics. And I was like, this doesn't make sense, like, we're crushing it. We're doing really good stuff, but they're basically taking from us and I mean, you get the social as part of this. So I was like, I was like, let's just go, let's try it. Let's try to do this on our own, see if we can do it, build a studio, do the whole thing, took my producer, and my director all quit our jobs, salaries Health Care. The whole thing we launched on patreon and it was a Monday morning. This is this is now around 2016 or so.
Padme. I'm sorry five years. Yeah.
And this was just the first step in true Independence. And I said, to my guys, it was Sunday night at like 11:30, we're about to go to bed, just launched it first thing in the morning. I said I may have completely fucked up our lives. I'd like, I may have like we're screwed. If this doesn't work within about 10 minutes the next morning. Once we launched, we were at about 30 grand a month. And I was like, we're going to be okay. And then that really that
then and you were pumping it through social media in terms, like promoting it
pushed it everywhere, I could. And people were
We were excited that somebody was going independent standing up for what they believe in all of that kind of stuff. Then, from there eventually Built My Own studio. So that was the next part of being independent. I wasn't renting Studio space anymore. What you guys have done here, you own this. No, but you know, maybe somebody's gonna, you know, chop the wire to shut off the lights but otherwise, you know, as long as you pay your bills, you're good to go. So that was the next part and then really what what fully did it was December of 2018. I was it was just about wrapping up, you know, I toured with Jordan Pederson for a year and a half which was
Un-freakin'-believable. I look back on it. Like, it was a dream. We did about a hundred twenty shows in 20 countries in a year in essence, and you guys are
just talking at the shows. Was it cold? So, I didn't warm up
before I would do about 15 minutes A Crowd warm-up, just get everybody laughing and having a good time, then he would give a. I mean, this guy is truly incredible. Like, when people think that this guy's incredible, he would give an hour-and-a-half lecture a different hour and a half lecture every night. I never heard the guy give the same speech twice somehow, sometimes he'd be, you know, it was 12 rules. For life was the book so sometimes he would go
Through all 12 rules, sometimes he would do one rule sometimes he would do no rules. If he was just angry at the New York Times, he would do an hour and a half on that, like, literally at. Sometimes he would be like, you know, I bumped into somebody before the show who told me that they're struggling with drug addiction. And then he talked about like, it was, it was truly. And the coolest part of it was that I would see him push his intellectual limits every night and then he would stop. Like, he would literally be like, he would be talking about something that could be like, you know, that's all I can say about that. Tonight, I'm going to think about
Added a little bit more. And then the next day he'd start the show by saying, you know, last night I was talking about this and I thought about it today. So I was basically watching choose-your-own-adventure I was watching a book being written throughout the whole thing. Anyway we're on tour December 2018 and I was on patreon that's where I was making like I don't know probably 80 or 90% of my companies rev and there was a guy by the name of Carl Benjamin Sargon of akkad on YouTube. He was like an old-school British liberal decent guy he went on another channel so now not his
A tree on channel, not his YouTube channel that was being funded on patreon. You went on somebody else's Channel and he said the n-word. Now, he did not say it to be racist. He was mocking the people who use that word. Patreon immediately deleted his account. This is where he was making most of his money running a business. Now they offered no chance of respite. There was no way he could talk to them. And to me, that was such an like, extraordinary escalation because it's one thing for a tech company to police what you're doing on the
With what you do on their site. But if they're basically watching you watching what you say on other sites, now we that's like can we do after you for whatever you do in your personal life. So Jordan and I discussed it and we had both had we were both friendly issue at least with with Carl Carl, Sargon of akkad and we both said, okay, it's time to leave
patreon and this was a big deal when you guys left,
right? It was I think it was Front Page New York Times that. Yeah.
For some reason we didn't know each other have time but I feel like I remember
It was like a one-two punch almost. Yeah. And like it'd be like, okay. Like that's an interesting data point.
Yeah. And then Sam Harris left the next day and he was making a ton on there and then and then a few other people left. But that is where they
weren't they all go. I wish you guys all gone. So what
happened? So basically, so ass off right over there as my brother-in-law and he's a tech guy and I called him and I said, listen, I want to leave patreon. I need you to put down what you're doing and build me a subscription model because that's the first piece. The first piece is, I need to be financially free and just replicate like the bare-bones patreons.
Then I contacted Patrick Collison at stripe, we had become friendly a little bit and I said, what is the best example of a subscription page that we can basically replicate and build for me, not not locals as a bigger idea. Just solve this problem for me. He told us one soft built it. And then from basically descent middle of December to January you, like how it's like
nobody gets Bill? Well, I just like the fact that you look at, what's the best one right here? What sort of the person who probably knows what the
best way to do that, was it? I was
He's like, I don't Patrick, this is what you do. And he said, this is the one and I said that's the one we're gonna build and is to Assad's credit. We built it. And basically, I used baby about three weeks, the end of December into January to tell. All of my people that I am deleting my patreon on January 15th, and I am launching Ruben report.com, which ultimately became the first test model for locals and by doing it on that day. And I did it on a live stream. I actually deleted live stream and I docs to myself like a moron because I didn't,
Why's that when I press delete on the patreon thing, my aunt my personal email was going to pop up. So I literally docks myself and I was drunk because I was doing shots of Patron in honor of leaving patreon. So I'm doing it for. So for every thousand dollars. I think that we made, I was going to do a shot. So I literally did like eight shots of tequila. I docks myself. Let me know. This is quite a day so there's some let did you know that
did you know that you doxxed
yourself? I mean you did it, I knew immediately and these people these sick twisted freak online I have been
Signed up for every porn site. You can imagine people literally paying for porn for. I mean people. Anyway, the next day though, that like, that's commitment. Like, when you literally are like, oh, I found someone that I don't like email address. I'm now going to see, it's not that they just signed me up for free. Take people. Literally, I was getting things, like, here's your password. You do, you think you'll use that email? It's long. God, it's long. I but I but, you know, it's hard to get rid of an email address. So like, yeah. Pushed you know, whatever. Anyway, this is the cool part. And this is what really was the Genesis of locals.
January 15th, close down patreon. The next morning. I woke up and I rev Jump by about 30, 35 percent from
what I want you to make a patreon. So you actually, we're making more on day one?
Yeah. Any more on day one and I wasn't doing rewards. So, you know, patreon is like geared towards you send him a t-shirt or you sign things are you do Zoom calls with people. We decided to get rid of all of that. If you want to support me being independent, talking about the things you care about giving me a chance to get more interviews out there. Expand these ideas, join us. We're not doing.
AIDS anymore. So I took away rewards but it's The Bravery thing. People want to support people that they think are fighting for the things in their world that they care about. It's why people love you over Bitcoin. You they believe in Bitcoin. And then here you are freaking screaming about this thing. Even in the last couple weeks where it's been very messy, your guys, love you even more because it's become because it's now has more of a cost for you, right? It's not at its peak right now and all that stuff. So we jump by about 35% and then I said to us off. Now we got something here because now
What else would I need to be free? I can't just be relying. YouTube. Could shut me down tomorrow, right? Twitter could show me down. So let's replicate these things. So we said, all right, we gotta build our own video player, we gotta build audio, we got to build a community, a news feed that son manipulated by an algorithm and by the way, having a pay wall, there's no trolls, there's no Bots. It's all good behavior in there, and if you want to pay me to troll me. Well, now I can neither profit off you or I boot you add in my local community, but you could still be in anyone elses locals Community, which is very different because on Twitter, if your boot,
Dude, your D platformed all together, so I think by building something that was right for me as a Creator, we have built something that I think solves probably 95% of the problems for 95% of the people. It doesn't solve, Alex Jones is problems and I don't know that I want to be in that business, but and now we have go awesome. Investors that are however
his what are his
problem. Well, he can't be on stripe, for example. So stripe is our primary payment processor, it's your own stripe account, it's not ours, we get 10 percent which is the same amount as page 1 but we have a much better.
Product and patreon because you own all of that. You own the data you on the user's, like if you nobody leaves us, but if you leave, it's all yours. You can take it with us if my channel locals is done so well. And if my channel blew up if YouTube just took me out tomorrow, man, you talk to pomp you're done. If they took me out tomorrow, my business is still thriving like I have something like 1.6 million subscribers on YouTube, I make way more with my thousands of subscribers on patreon. So I've built a steady model
To make myself on cancellable. And that's what we then were like. All right, now we've got a business here, let's
let's quit. What are the funds number. So I think there's a lot of people who are interested in this. Some of them are interested because they literally fear being canceled for what they say. There's people who fear the platforms are just manipulating things. There's people who feared that distribution goes away. Yep, there's people who fear that they will get caught up by association, right? They interview somebody, whatever. And then there's literally people who just figure like chaos. Yeah. You know what? I did, nothing. I talked to know.
Like, I don't have an account in that maybe doesn't work, either just like something bad happened, right? And you see it all, you know, something on Twitter gets suspended in there. Like I haven't eaten in three days or whatever and usually it's like some stupid thing where there's a Founder that I invested in this company. There was an event that happened in the world. He started to get a bunch of followers and I see. No, he's suspended. My guess. Is that literally there's like an automated system. It looked like spam to them because it was like an explosion of followers or something. It's suspended.
Dedenne, aren't the point is, you don't know, well, no problem, but still just that can
happen or whatever. So, I guess, like, when you think about all of that, what are the ingredients to be credible, independent, or like to really be resilient on the audit today? So, you
first off, you have to have direct access to your audience. That's number one. So when I tell you, I have whatever it is. 1.6 million, YouTube subscribers. I can't get videos out to them because the algorithm now they've decided that you're subscribed. This is just what they've decided at YouTube.
Subscribers actually have less weight now, so they're sending you videos. Usually, now based on your viewing habits, which by the way, can really pigeon-holed you into a certain political belief, or religious belief, or whatever it might be. Or for me, it's just sending me a lot of 80s, basketball and Star Wars videos all day long. Like, I'm watching you use, what might be, you know, you know, that that's really the way to get to know somebody. Just why? Look at their YouTube history. It's like, man, I have watched the 1992 NBA season, everything backwards and forwards, I don't watch Regular basket anymore. I can't take it because it's all political and whatever.
But you you want direct communication with your audience so what we built. I mean the locals app is awesome, you get push notifications when I post things so that's just one like you will get my stuff. We're not manipulating it with an algorithm. The news feed is unmanipulated so that's
part in its reverse chronological. So if I yes sign in the last thing you posted as first, I can kind of go back and just see and you can simmer like a Facebook profile page or something,
right? And it's you can either filter it if you're in the Rubin report Community can filter it.
Why when I'm posting or we let all our users post. And by the way, we're getting something. Like what's the number eighty percent of the content? Something like 80% of the content in my community is from the users, not from me and what's interesting about that is they're posting recipes. They're posting music, they're posting things about sports, all kinds of stuff things that they know I like but then people are sort of coming to social media in with fresh eyes because as opposed to you post a pic, your picture early, you post a recipe, you know, you make chicken parm, you post it on?
Next thing, you know your grandma's fighting with some random person about Trump and it's like man this all became evil and now grandma doesn't seem as nice as Grandma's supposed to be and I don't know who that person is but oh, it turns out I was I went to high school with them 20 years by now and it but it all feels awful on there. We have people coming to that. There's a common what I want every local community have and this is what they all have is. You could just come together for some common cause so for a guy like you would be okay, I love Bitcoin. I believe this is the future of Commerce and the engine that's going to lead us to the new world and then
Will our like Au Pomme school? Like I'm going to come into this community, we're going to talk about stuff. And then what you're going to find is they're gonna start talking about a lot of other stuff, so it's what social media was supposed to be. And again, because of the pay wall, you get rid of all. If you had a 10 cent pay wall, as I said on locals are as I think. I said that you are a prophet, our minimum is two dollars, but if we had a 10-cent pay wall, that would eliminate almost all the Bad actors really.
What you're doing is, you're basically taking patreon or kind of pay or a subset will be. Another example, all these kind of pay wall, based individual products, you bringing
You all together on one platform, you're saying, hey, everything video to text to audio whatever you can basically come and do behind this pay wall in a community. You as the individual, that owns the community or as kind of the Creator, you're the mayor innocent and you can then bring everyone together. They all can communicate with each other. They can communicate with you and it's Kumbaya Off to the Races and because the pay wall because people have to subscribe because they want to hear from you, it changes the Dynamics rather than just like, you know, just mass chaos on Twitter.
Not only did completely changed the Dynamics, but you set the rules. So, if in your community, let's say you said, like, I made an announcement, very early on. I was like, listen, you guys can, say whatever you want, here you say whatever. I don't break the laws of the United States, but if you break the laws and I said, you got a bigger problem than me or locals, right? So don't bring those United States and we don't allow for porn. That's pretty much it. If you want to, I have plenty of people that come in there and
there's bad people know porn. Like,
there's enough people doing porn online like their the
porno. Only friends, I just saw the genre's it over a billion dollars. That's
fine.
So that in Forbes, it's like Jesus. They're doing right. But but we'll people were giving me shit about it. I was just like, you know what, like what was really worried. Yeah. Like well because why Dave, you're the Free Speech guy like porns free and this is not even be making a commentary on point. I was just like this enough stuff going on, like, we don't need to be in that world. And by the way, it also complicates things as, you know, with payment processors and a whole bunch of other stuff. So, it was just like, you just, you pick what your battles are.
That's the problem with being the Free Speech guy.
No, it is. Well, that's the thing. So when people, so that's why we did it. This way, that speech is left.
To you as the Creator that because you're creating your community, it's like having your hair rules. So you come into my house. You can't just walk into my house and be like, Dave, you're a fucking asshole, like then you got to leave my house. So that's how we treat, you know. Like, that's pretty simple. But you can say whatever you want outside of my house. So so we leave it on to you as the Creator. And by doing that, I think that that's the spirit of what free speech is, like, I'm not here to go. I can't. You want me to have a policy around hate speech? Okay, well, what's one person?
Free speech is someone else's hate speech. So that how much of the most
mature related? The users that are on? There are politics related. The actually is other things. Right? And reason why I asked, this isn't some one of the things that fascinates me is, it's very clear in the political circles. People who think about this a lot who spend time their censorship D platforming. Like it seems like a lot of that happens there. Yeah. No actually. Maybe it's happened to some other places right across various platforms and not just the United States and you know internationally as well so just like out of
I'll see how much of it is politics related communities versus
other. Yeah, I don't know that I can give you an exact percentage, maybe you can. But what I can tell you is this flipping
it over under 50% politics probably over,
right? It's probably a little bit over.
Yeah.
Nutrition. So yeah.
So first I would first answer that by saying locals is for everybody, if you have an interest and you have people that care about your interest, you should be on local? Yeah, but they're great. We have a great product for S, not even just a crater, if you run a I have a friend who runs a like a Babe, Ruth baseball league in Jersey. It's like he were onboarding him because he's got this community, he doesn't want it to be on Facebook anymore because Facebook's melting down. And it's like if you have a community of any Knitters unboxers, whatever it is. We want you to be on there. That's, that's the first part.
More toys for the percentage. I'm not, I'm not totally sure, but I will tell you this, for sure, it's leaning political because the people who are the early adopters on this stuff, who are sensitive, about free speech and censorship are in the political world. So it's just, it's a function, but I think you'll find this really interesting, which is when we were raising funds. Originally, we would go into, we went into every, you know, whoever is in your head right now, in the catalog of the investors in Silicon Valley, we went into every office. We never, once I kid you not heard anyone complain about the tech say that we had some
massive weakness or he wasn't right. Nobody said that the mission was in, right? Everybody, loved all of that stuff. When we got nose, the nose always came down to one thing, it's political Dave, your thought of his, a little bit, right? Or something? Something we got to be careful, you know, when this all changed covid. Well, a little bit after Cody, but it's actually connected to covid because covid. Basically, we all had a big Tech problem. And then what happened because of covid-19 more obsessed with big Tech it all changed on January 6, interest. Well actually, I
January 12th or so like four days later when they blew up the Parlor servers because when Amazon Blew Up The Parlor, servers parlor had 23 million people on
there. All right, because I feel ya details parlor was a app
like I told her, it was basically a Twitter clone that that people that were frustrated with Twitter. Mostly conservative leaning people. We're
starting parlor. They were leaving Twitter and going to this other place. I remember
seeing at least being they're both, but trying to migrate. Okay, Parker there was an
effort to go.
Yeah, I think you just said that they had 23 million
users. Yeah, you think users huge number and it was
it was running around. How many Twitter has 300
million? Is that right? I think so. So let's probably really like seven people, but
let's just say that, but I should be clear. I really like Jack. I don't know if you like Jack or not. No, no. Okay. All right.
We have never met him and I would like to meet him. I like
him because of all the Bitcoin stuff and I think he's got a very unique view of the world and the special. He's in a unique seat where he can.
But outsized impact because of Twitter square and like his View and how important he thinks is we can talk about
later. Well, can I just let me just say one thing about him which is that he should just have a different job in my opinion. I'm sure he's a decent person and I know he's doing good stuff leading the the Bitcoin Revolution and all that. But like to me it's like the the Twitter part of it, where there were so many important things related to all the societal stuff they were talking about here. He just needed to hand that job to somebody who is more capable of dealing with those issues. Did you see?
I don't know how we got. Yeah, I don't know how we got to Jack.
Jack. But he did a, I think he went on first, it was Jack and Joe Rogan. Yeah. And then he broke that conversation and then there's a second episode. And it's like Tim pull, Joe Rogan Jack. And I forget the woman's name, but she runs
like or something
kind of policy and he's like, she sees the lawyer singly who was like really into like who gets to stay, who doesn't whatever. I actually took away from that conversation. I think I listened to it twice or yeah, I think is just rice.
Way more complex than most people, give it credit right in terms like Zelda. Ah I can't leave you guys to this whatever the second thing was like they actually had some like good Frameworks for how they evaluate, how they get applied, you can debate or sure whatever and it seemed to me like the classic example of like Jack Twitter and the team is like on one side. Like Tim pool, really was like ugly divorce. I got and then they kind of like we didn't meet in the middle but like they got a lot closer to
The conversation? Yeah. Biggest, takeaway from whole thing. Was like, man, people who disagree, if they just sat down and talked to each other, like the world would be so much further
ahead. It was an incredible discussion, actually, all I would say on that so we don't get too lost in Jackie's. It just seems to me. He should probably have some other job that they should probably have someone. That's a little more engaged and a little more. I think he likes that further. Yeah, I
think he's publicly said that he nor does, he want Twitter to be in the position of making those decisions, like the whole. Like,
but I just got a day if you boot, if you boot Donald Trump and you're the CEO of the company,
Then drier so okay okay we have to get lost on Jack though. Don't
talk shit about Jack.
I'm sure you know like I don't think he's a bad that's the problem that all of us in this public thing or put in it's like you have to have opinions about. Yeah I we have opinions about things laughs. Do we have here is
the other thing that I will say this really fascinating and maybe Jack's actually a pretty good example. Humans are really complex because we live in a complex world and so in some crazy way I bet you if you
You asked Jack and he may kill me for saying this, but if you asked him, he could probably with great accuracy. Say, because my beliefs on bitcoin, here's my beliefs, on Free Speech. Here's my beliefs, on Twitter's my beliefs on Square, here's my beliefs on whatever else. And then he could retroactively almost look at like how everything's played out at square and Twitter, and with Bitcoin and like pretty accurately, probably identify. I wish we did this better. I think that that will went right. I know people didn't like this idea, but I still
Was the right decision like and when you do that I think it's this interesting thing of its kind of like with Trump when he first became president, I remember saying to a couple people. I don't really know anything about this guy but Steve schwarzman and all these folks who for all intents and purposes seem pretty intelligent. Yeah they all keep going in meetings with no walking away and saying like pretty High Praise again they'll be full of shit. There's actually morons ever talk to him before.
You know, like all the stuff. Yeah. Like that's interesting. And I think that a lot of these leaders of these big companies, when you talk to the people who know them, if I Elon Elon was loved in the Bitcoin Community, now he's like, you know, basically was like yell and scream about whatever you talk to people who know them and they're just like, did he's like a like if he came and said so right now
being he's just a human we
would all talk to him and be like you know what that guys like super scary. Smart by the way, like he probably has a sick sense of humor like in some areas and like whatever.
The Twitter account, right? But did the takeaway would it be? Oh he's a dick or like he's like truly evil. So that's I'm honestly, I'm not. I really try not to go after people's motives. I actually think it's very possible that what you're saying there when he took all of those things that he had in front of him and how they all map together. But then Twitter became something that no one could have ever. That's the thing. No one could have ever imagined what these texts setting up my Twitter. Yeah
yeah
right. Like said yeah. There you go like we couldn't have imagined and he was just the guy that was in charge.
Of it and that doesn't make him God or evil necessarily. So yes. When even though I can be critical of some of the mistakes, I mean trust me you know I'm now partly running a tech company. Like I'm I going to make mistakes and are people going to go on podcast saying they don't like Dave Rubin a well, it's
okay. I think they've already said that. Somebody definitely said that. Again again, my
Twitter mentions are not on. So I wouldn't know, I wouldn't
know. All right,
are there is where you were going. Yeah.
So
It starts to become popular. Yeah, 23 million users whatever. Let's say that's five to ten percent of Twitter's audience I think. Yeah what happened.
So in essence, what happened was it was it was all the conservative right-leaning people, tons of trump people on there and parlor was basically doing no, moderation whatsoever. Apparently Apple did ask them a couple times to do some moderation and they just weren't doing it. We had a couple conversations with them because we thought, maybe we could work with them very early on and it became
Sort of clear to us that they were just going to play by their own rules and, and the truth is even for all of us that don't like rules. There's a system in place as we're talking about and sometimes you got to play Within that system, right? You can't just do everything at once.
And then Apple was asking them to moderate, like, whatever they considered, breaking the law type stuff or
so. I think it was, well, I think they were doing something a little closer to hate speech, which is always that sort of a more fist like, well, what is hate speech? Exactly. And can you say this about this protected group, but not about this particular all that. Yeah,
but of course they
Slices, you let you live in that world that's like a world that is
freaking murky. It isn't what you see, swamp.
It's a I think myself I can speak for myself and I think a lot of people that I can spend time with, they like things like Bitcoin or technology, or whatever because it's like, it either works or doesn't like the code either works or it doesn't or whatever. And when you get into this whole world of like politics and and hate speech and like, whatever. I think there's a lot of things that people
So we may say and they're like yep that goes in good or bad bucket, right? And it's very obvious, if I say I love you good bucket. If I say, you know, the n-word IU bad but like all the stuff then there's stuff that's kind of in like the gray area. And I think that's kind of what you're getting at. Is like it almost then you start asking Constable like who said it? Who did they say it to? Well, that's whatever. And that's where I think a lot of Technologies are just like this. There's no like yes no there's no one that one or zero, right? And so like that's just like a whole different
world. Well that's why. I'm also telling you I have sympathy for Jack you know. I mean that's why I'm saying
He got involved in something that he did not intend to get involved in that became something so massive, he could have never imagined it. So let's just real quick. I'm like the hate speech part, the Supreme Court of the United States has this. There's no such thing as hate speech. Meaning, if you Jesus like really, there isn't? Yeah, because you can, if you break the laws of the United States, you're in trouble but you're allowed to say mean things about people, you can't directly coordinate a violent terrorist attack or tell a mob to kill somebody or yell fire in a crowded theater with the intent to do harm. You actually people don't
oh, this, you actually can yell fire in a crowded theater in a funny context, or but if you're doing it to brighten up people, that's with, that's with intent and you can't do it. So, but the point is beyond those things and then the very almost never used laws around slander. Slander and libel, which are pretty much never used because they're so strict, there's no such thing as hate speech, you're allowed to say. I don't like Jews. I would prefer that people not say it, but you're allowed to say it. You're allowed say, I don't like black people. I don't like gay people but you can't say go kill all those black people or that sort of thing. So the point is we've now
Ask technology companies to do things that the United States government has decided it can't do. So it's like we're trying to empower them in some ways to be more powerful. So parlor, basically was just like we're not going to you do whatever the hell you want to do on here, then the January 6, Capital riots happened and then really what happened that nobody's written. A proper story on. Is that the answer five or six days later was to blow up the Parlor servers. So and what does that mean? So Amazon just took down the Parlor servers. I don't know what
That you probably know on board in the me like I do know, is that a button? Is there a button and Amazon?
Like she said, blahblahblah okay there's something I don't know. That's coming
next. I think the next version, I'm not kidding, actually, but the next version of like this information war is that they will literally blow up server Farms but putting aside that for a second. He's right. That's good for the decentralized people. So we're doing. Alright. But but I don't know. I honestly don't know like what how does Amazon
just shut up. I just shut down the cameras on certainly tws like ec2 instance, or what
is that pulling the plug? Like I don't know what you're doing there.
Button. It depends where they do it.
They probably have multiple ways to become a
server, right then. But I would like to think it's something dramatic, not just like tapping a button, like, you would like, to be like sometimes
five more button than physically. Take over two rows, 7 in this data center. Pull the plug that
that actually but that for the movie version of this seems better you know they could Bob going 407. Yeah. Who's
servers it up.
Anyway, what happened there? When Amazon did that was a massive or yeah. When I was under that was a massive
Escalation because this wasn't like kicking off individual people or kicking off a group or even kicking off the president of the United States, which was happening at the exact same time. This was saying this entire network of 23 million people cannot be online and subsequently what we found out. Now, I mean, there's many articles written about this is that there was far more coordination for the January 6 events, regardless of what you think about them, far more coordination on Facebook than on parlor. So if anything was supposed to be blown up, if that's what you think, the answer to this was
Should have been Facebook, not parlor. So, in essence, what really happened? There was The Tech Guys. All saw. Oh, that's actual competition. And it's not funded by any of our people. It's not funded by any of the tech world people and it was a mafia movie. It was just like, you can't encroach, you're from Jersey Mafia, you know, your ground New York, you know, your ground. You can't play over here and we're just going to take you out, so that's what happened. Oh, but the reason we got a cup, so parlor is back, okay, it's a little unclear if they're getting a lot of traction right now, we've had some talks with them like
I wanted to succeed because I love competition and I love, I love just more. I want more stuff to be out there to hopefully make these products better. It's like if parlor can do something that. That is some feature, let's say or something that Twitter is like, oh, we got to do that. Well, then maybe they buy them, maybe they build a better feature like that's beauty of all it. Anyway, after that happened and parlor went down. Suddenly our phones were ringing off the
hook from investors investors. Because
everybody was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, something the war. Just
Majorly leveled up like this is not about booting individual people anymore. Now we see the like the true power that these guys have over us and then fortunately because of that we got awesome investors and and the company's growing
and are you able to set so I invested. Yeah. Who else is in that router? You will say
so David Sachs leather around from Craft and he's just been like extraordinarily awesome. He's opened doors for us and just he really literally in the, you know, if I've learned one thing, I'm sure you have your version.
Of this in investing, all the people that want to have long meetings, never invest, and they just want to talk. And it's just in retrospect, it's bullshit and they're just mining you for data and hours and O7 follow-up meetings. And I'll talk to this guy but and they just take all your shit. The all the people and you included. We literally had like a two-minute conversation. I actually don't even think we asked within like 30 seconds you were like I want in like let's do this. Literally, I'm not making
that up. Okay. You guys are going to be resilient. All right?
Yeah, no.
That's you were kind of like, I like what you're doing, you're fighting like, this is a mess, like let's figure it out and, and Sachs was like that and Balaji who you mentioned before is in and of all is in and give me some other names or in Hoffman's in and Christian angermeyer, and we just got like a, he's the mushroom guy.
We should start that. By the way, is the mushroom after the article. Christian, I love you, but after that article where I was like, you know, was a German, billionaire. Finally figured out Bitcoin on mushrooms, like we should just call the mushroom
guy.
Well, I told you right before we started, I don't think he would have a problem. Be saying this publicly, but I've been, we've become good friends. And I've been to many parties with him where I always thought he was drunk. And then he did my show, we're going to release it in like a week or so, and he said in the show that he's not, he's never had alcohol, never, but he's always on, you know, like a low dose and mushroom so he's always got that look in his eyes and he's Smiley kind of like you right now. He's got that look just happy and I'm not on mushrooms and yet you're still into
Bitcoin. That's not. Yeah, that's the other thing he told,
The which was happening is he tries his best to not get on the Autobahn in Germany? Because he's really into longevity and so
we can all the data
car accidents or like the you know one of the highest reasons why you would have a shortened lifespan.
It's one of my basketball, Heroes growing up, Drazen Petrovic from the New Jersey Nets died on the Autobahn. It was life. There you
go. All right, so as we kind of continue down this road, the number one question that now, I think we would talk for like an hour and 40 minutes. We haven't asked you yet
One wants to know, what do you think about Bitcoin? So so that was where this, so we talk about everything
else. This what do you think I'm making? This was a hell of a lead in that you did there. That was amazing. So I honestly believe this is all the future so I cannot. What does that mean? So first off, let me say I cannot talk about Bitcoin at the technical level. That is going to impress you at any level whatsoever or any of your viewers if I get into any of this like it's not my world and it's a world that I'm
just. Can you talk to us about the my
Are signaling for Taproot I can do activation, pretty
extensive dissertation on that. Specifically, the idea of decentralized Finance is so connected to everything that we've talked about here and a bottom-up economy. And that people need the ability to have unfettered access to the goods and services and people that they want to communicate with without central banks and without Federal Reserve and all of those things that is where I can sort of do this at the ideal level. Like this is
It's so obviously the answer it's so obviously the answer all the specifics on what the best coins are and all that kind of stuff is not my thing. However, I will say that as we're building on locals like we're working on all sorts of decentralized payments right now and trying to figure out, you know, subscription models with with different cryptos, which is extremely complex because obviously, the prices are going up and down and all that. I have some Bitcoin. It's lies. You own Bitcoin. I don't, they're quite alright. I have seven,
Bitcoin. Do you 7?
Yeah, that were all given to me by the way, whenever I never spent a dime on
Wait what very very well because very early on when I left the patreon thing and I did that people because a lot of my audience is Libertarians and they were like, hey, put a Bitcoin wallet up there and I put it while it up. And people would give me little bits here and there and I was just like, all right, let's see what happens. And this is kind of fun like $300,000. And now I've got seven of them, it's on a ledger and the ledgers in a saint here up. Same thing and you know I got the thing in the thing. Yeah.
You're further along than most? Yeah. Do you remember the first time I heard
about big one?
I think it was it was right when we left,
so I 27 days, right? I'm teaching on. So that's like 2016
2016, okay? Very early on because I remember, yeah, I do remember. We were leaving patreon and I was I had a Paypal, you know, a page that you go to, to donate or whatever think I had a Paypal. And maybe that was even before stripe and my Libertarians that were in my comments section. They Dave Bitcoin Bitcoin, open a wallet open and I really didn't know what it was but like, but what
Cool about it was like, I was like, oh well here are these people who like whatever it is I'm talking about. I'm talking about freedom and free speech, and states rights, and all of these things and low taxes and Baba, and they're all into something. So there's got to be something here. So that was sort of how I kind of entered this world. And now it's like well now I'm in it because we got a tech company and I want to solve these problems. So it's like the stripe thing is really interesting one again, I like Patrick Collison. I think stripe is a great company and it's been great for us but like do I
Not only people who are on, striped me on locals. Know I do want it to be more open than
so it's less about get off stripe and it's more about stripe plus other on ya. I want I want have diversification across payment channels and almost let people choose what payment she'll do. Any
is can I say that? Because that's what I want. Yes alright I got clearance I got clearance from the big man. No well that's that's Morris ops world but but yes we want as many options out there because otherwise the choke points. You know what's accepted to be said at least.
That this time in America is going to continue to be like this from a mainstream perspective. So you want as many options when it comes to payments. We want as many options when it comes to servers, right? We don't want, you know, Amazon to blow us up or this or that is I think I probably can't talk about all that we're working on on that front because just for security reasons, you know what I mean? But like you want to create something that is as not you while you. I think. Yes. But like I want to create something that is as free and accessible and
decent and neutral as is humanly
possible.
When you think of Bitcoin and kind of that entire world, that entire audience are there, things that you see that kind of a line from how you feel about the political standpoint, The free-speech Other Nation States. Like it just feels like Bitcoin is such a natural thing. Given everything else you talk about, think about all day long. Are you surprised that maybe like, more people in that world haven't flocked to bitcoin or kind of embraced it?
Or is there like some sort of like obstacle in terms of it's a technology thing and that's just a different or
yeah, well on the purely ideological part, as I said it fits because most of my audience is there. Not necessarily like card-carrying Libertarians but like they get like there's a philosophical line, right? So the philosophical part is there, I would say for certain part. This would probably be, like, sort of like my parents. Like, there's like this other piece of, like, what do you mean? It's not backed by something or it's back, but are it's all on computers or they're minors. But
They mining where the mines like, all of that kind of stuff getting a certain person and that's why it's so that's actually so consistent with what's going on in the world right now. Like everything is changing and then because of social media is changing so fast that it's like, it's really hard to say to somebody that like put all their money in stocks and bonds and, you know, I put all this money into my IRA all these years and all that. Like even when I was talking to my business managers a few months ago as well as we're doing, you know, planning and my guys like, you know, I want you to put x amount in your IRA.
Every year for the next Bond, then you're going to have this. And, you know, and I'm thinking well, hey, like it does, that
may be
exactly but that's not a thought that someone really would have had 10 years ago, the belief that the system itself would keep marching along no matter what was there. But you know, if you talk to somebody in Greece as they watched all of their money disappear and going to the ATM, you know, you're getting, you know, no drachmas are showing up or when they do, they're they're worth nothing. It's like that piece of it. It's like for all the
Isn't that I went independent, in terms of my content, I Want to Be Free the on my, on the economic side
as well. Yeah, it's fascinating that there's now a piece of technology that embodies so much of this. Yeah. And as people learn about it, talk about it. Like of course that's going to be a thing
but that's why it's so cool. So like I think the way I came across you was somebody retweeted you into my feed, something about Bitcoin, and then it's like, all right, you know, you know, how Twitter works on something, you click on somebody's profile, you quickly kind of looking around and it's like you were not talking about politics,
X per se, but it was just obvious that the way you look at the world is similar to the way that I look at the world. And again, I don't know it. All your political beliefs are and it's completely irrelevant to me. If we, if we, I think we're going out to dinner after. It's like, we got dinner were knocking back. Tequila. And then we turns out we disagree on every policy. It would be irrelevant, you know, to be like utterly irrelevant, you're a good guy. You care about what you're doing. Like I like people who are doing things and passionate and, you know, all that
stuff. You've said, multiple times about somebody, they're decent, they're decent human. He said, I actually think well, it's, um,
Of an elementary shooting was like, an elementary term but it's actually like a pretty good bar, right of because you can disagree with somebody on everything but, you know, decent person. Yeah, like that's actually like, a good way of viewing. Are they a good person or not? Like, are they decent?
Yes. Decent. Like, are you just decent, like not you get everything right? Not that, you're so spectacular, nothing really great anything but like are you just a deal? You know, and you know it when you're with someone, you know, is this decent person or not a decent person that's like and it's sort of like
Like you know people say you know what is what is pouring? Well you'll know it when you see it sort of thing and that's kind of like a decent person. But but anyway that's why I think what's happening right now and why I'm so excited to move locals down here and be here right now and just like be part of what's going on in Miami. It's like and the fact that I'm going to talk to the mayor who's retweeting me left and right now, thanks to you. It's like it's like whoa, there's a new world on the horizon. Like it is it is the what do you call it is that simple, a future that the Libertarians want
I love those colors that color scheme like and I've always and I love dystopian movies and I love like all that future stuff but we have a chance to really build it right now. We really do and there's a lot of people who are just holding on and they're holding on and you can in some ways you can't blame them. It's sort of like we were like the jack thing in a way. It's like you can't blame people who are seeing something in a certain way when the world was set up, in one way, for such a long time. Like I can't blame my dad, have a wild idea. Yeah.
If I could get Jack to sit down with, you just said out, of course, of
course. Yeah, he had agreed a few times with his PR people, and then it just never came through. Now, I, I've gone after him pretty hard on on Twitter. You were my would have, I would have, I promise you, if you can set it up, I will have no problem. Starting the conversation by saying, I apologize for anything that I said, I
cannot make any promises at all. That would be like a pretty out-of-left-field thing, but let me see that I would be interested to see you to sit down and have a conversation. I would I would I would learn from both of you. I think.
You could moderate it, you got
that. But I honestly if you can tell him where you started off with you get moderate and set the rules. I'm out, you're a decent guy, decent guy, Jack's, these artifacts
music to all right three decent guys.
All right, I seem to recall you get asked me. Once again, most important book you ever read
most important, you know, I've read so many books in the last. So one thing when I started the show, I used to read.
Every book, every book, I guess every single one and then just life got busier and I just can't do it anymore. This is gonna sound a little cliche but not only cuz I was on tour with him. But 12 rules were life really changed my life, really? Like if you read that book and you put those ideas into practice, whether it's standing up straight with your shoulders, back, telling the truth, like he's laying out, the things that if you do these things, I saw this guy freaking change the world and and in the course of changing world has changed my life. So
that's a great simple yet. Powerful.
Book.
Sleep schedule, our friends at eight sleep. Yeah. Who now I've invested, I beg them to invest. They finally let me invest and now I feel like I can really ask this question. Egg
people to invest
these guys? Listen, they have a mattress that I usually like five or six hours, like literally. I think, one time, I told my girlfriend at the time now, wife wolves. Don't sleep. She was like, why are you so full? So sleep, is you like you're an idiot? I know the probably sure. Now, I see like eight or nine hours, completely changed my life. And when I sleep on this,
You can get hot or cold, I sleep on a link. It's like ice cubes. Yeah. I like their ultimate goal is to take eight hours of sleep, compress it down to six, but you get the same amount of deep sleep and therefore, it's like better whatever.
Wait, what's it called? Eight, sleep. Okay, I need to know about eight hours of stuff. Right now, genius
marketing, uh, what is your sleep schedule now and then what was it, like through the years? And how is that of all?
It's a great question. So, I hugely, I believe in SLI, you need sleep, especially when you're just doing stuff with your brain all day.
A long and talking all day long and listening all day long. And that's not to diminish people that are just doing things with their hands all day. That may seem trivial but are not actually, I basically go to sleep. Usually about 11:30 or so. Okay, I wake up about six. I'm very functional in the morning. If I wake up, I have coffee and I just work. Work work work, work. And then, at some point, it's like 4 o'clock and I'm like, well, I should just like breathe for a sec. Sometimes, I forgot to have lunch. I've done five shows, you know, that kind of stuff, I
Do like taking a 20-minute nap if I can around three o'clock. If I can yeste little siesta or just literally, it's not even an app like I'm sleeping. But it's literally just closed my eyes for 20 minutes and just like, let myself reset. I think is absolutely key. I'm not the greatest sleeper though. So I am interested in this six
six and a half hours is not a
lot. Yeah. Yeah. She's trying to get eight because you go to sleep at. Is there some sort of company you've invested in that maybe could help me in this department? Is
that will work on it? Yeah, all right, alien.
Ins believer or non-believer?
I could give you a couple couple answers here.
What do you know that? We don't
know. Yes, there is. There is other life out there. Okay? Why. Because I think there just has to be like, well, look, there's a beautiful way to say no to it. The beautiful Wei is know that this thing that we're doing right now in our existence, here is so unique and so special. And the Majestic magical Cosmos that put the Earth, so close to the Sun and all the elements were right and that.
All just like this magical, incredible Godlike event that and then we're here at it's just us and like that's actually rare and precious and beautiful and I actually love that answer. The other part of me that is most of me is just like we're here. There's got to be some other stuff out there. And over over time, we will find that. I would direct people to watch the movie contact by Carl Sagan and it's something like that.
If you had to choose this as a fourth question, I'm cheating up. If you
You had to choose. Are you more worried about what's in the ocean or what's in space?
You rather go to the depths of the ocean or go to space
yourself. I will personally, which would I like to go to? Yeah. Space. Like, I just love sci-fi stuff and like, all right, you know, Star Wars like Define my life for so long before they ruined it and
like there's something about the depths of the ocean, like the depth of the. Oh, no, I'm out.
Do you know, your, you know,
like they might put you in like a submarine and I'm just like I heard, I send you down like two miles and really good. I'm
out. It's it doesn't seem possible really, you know,
well and then like you like see things that like you're like
I didn't know. That was an animal. You ever seen like these videos? You like what? No, that just pretty change colors. Like, it just moves shaped like, I don't know.
But are those aliens? That's the question. Is a good question, is a question? I don't know. All right. Well, one quiet. Yeah, I get to ask you a question. That's a good one. I was thinking about it. This is like the
scariest thing in the world is letting you ask me a question. Yeah.
All right, the more you think about it the more nervous like kid? Well, I think you've
addressed this a little bit but I think it's there. It's the question that would be on my mind to ask you the most. All right, which is what do you really think is going on with Ilan? And Bitcoin
is that too? Cliche you oh, no. I think everyone's overthinking it. I literally think that let me address all of it as kind of a like a grand scale. Yeah.
Can I add one sentence in first? The Layman.
Version because I saw him pumping it up. We're gonna and again, this isn't totally my world. He's pumping it up. We're taking it for Tesla, blah, blah, blah. Then he goes on SNL, which is like a mainstream airlock moment for him. There's all the controversy around that and then, you know, in essence, five days later, you know, we're out so that all just in my world, the way I pieced very chaotic, this feels very chaotic, and also oddly coordinated and whatever.
Yeah, so
I always want to assign that. He's very decent guy. Thanks like ignorance not malice in law situations. I literally go back to you don't have a master plan. I don't have a master plan. I don't think he'll on has a master plan. Click. Yes, he is the most or second or third, most rich person in the world. I literally don't think he thinks of him that way right off the heel. I guess you wakes up, he's like, you know what, ha ha ha, the richest guy in the world. Like, screw you guys right there. Just don't think that like, you get to that point.
And that's how you think everything, Maybe I'm Wrong. The second thing is, I think that he is a rational economic actor, from the sense of saw an asset that he believed, could be valuable, he had Capital, he bought some of it. He said, hey, you guys can pay move some of it. Not that many people I think 0 or 1 cars were about that coin. Like less than five for sure.
And that's surprising though. Well, I mean, it's an intelligence test. Am I gonna die? Gonna send Bitcoin, right? If I owned the corner, but I think it's gonna go, you know, hiring you as our value over time and buy a car like, okay. So like counterintuitive at first, when you think about it like okay makes sense, why no? Okay then the second aspect is they sold Bitcoin 10% of their stake. They tested liquidity of the market happened that they could really beat on her.
Report and like, there's always like components to it. And I just say, all of us, have all these conspiracy theories, throw them all out the window. I literally think he's having fun which you can argue. Good bad hurting, people, helping people like there's all these ramifications of it. Forget all the ramifications for a second. What drives the tweet. Every time he tries positive or negative. I
literally think he's like the
rest of us. We grab our phone or I gotta watch
this that sweet and
sometimes
He's people are attacking them and he's like, you know, I'm going to stick it to the bitcoiners and he fires off a Dogecoin tweet. Yeah and then sometimes he's like all giddy and he
I really believe in Bitcoin, you know? Because that would be kind of psycho stuff though if you knew, you could have that much influence on people's lives and like the
course, I think. Emily is three. I think you, I am an anyone with a big account completely forget and Arkham. Not oblivious, oblivious would be too strong of a word we drastic.
Underestimate the impact. Like I when I tweet, I forget that there are a million
people, right? So it's The Accidental psycho sort of at some level. I think you're some crazy
way were all regardless of what we want to say we all want to like virtuous, even bigger, I'm not addicted whatever. Like how many times you pick up your phone? If you go on Apple you can look it up. I think what that way I looked I never want to look again. Like there's a lot of things that I would rather do never look at my how many times people have, you
know, I do Off the Grid August where I lock my phone in there for a month. Wait what does it mean?
My fifth year doing it. Okay? When I literally, I did it as a test for years ago and I okay, literally lock my phone in a safe. My computer, my iPad. No nothing. I do know news. I dunno really know karna vents. I don't even go to the gym because they have TVs everywhere and then I come back on the grid and I've had been Shapiro did it with me once, Glenn Beck, Michael knows. Couple other guys. We do it live where they fill me in on everything that I've missed and I watch, no TV. Nothing electronic.
What's the craziest thing that happened while you were gone? Well, you
think that crazy, like,
You're John McCain died one year? Well, last year, the big thing was that the song lap came out? That seems to be the biggest and I guess, what's your name is Arianna. Know who? I don't know, some, yes, great song for pussies dripping out and do whatever. He's got a bucket or something, but no, you realize very quickly that actually, it's okay. You know? Like, yeah, some stuff the Republicans voted on this and they're up. Yeah. Something blew up in Lebanon or something and like and it's just like the world goes on, but I find it just like, you know, worried my whole month, that's great.
Yeah. Yeah. Go lay on the beach stare and you can
call it whatever these are off the grid
August. Yeah, I'm gonna challenge some people publicly. I know you can't do a month, but maybe could I get you on a
weekend? You think you could maybe do a weekend. You can do what you want you in here, actually. So, yeah, pretty crazy. It's happened twice. So three years ago or so I took two weeks off. I cheated a little bit like I would still go on Twitter and read a little bit. Yeah. But I didn't tweet and I really really stayed off and I always joke that I knew that it wasn't working because multiple times
I was living in New York, my wife and I would go for a run and I would leave my phone behind which would be Blasphemous. Yeah any other time and I think carefully call me the weather. I just don't care. Right? And the second time was when I went to Iraq and I came back, I didn't have a cell phone for a year and I was young. I was 21 or whatever. When I came back and I remember. Did you serve in Iraq? Oh yeah. Oh yeah I didn't know that. I got lots of pot. Sweet let's not go there. Yeah and so when I came back, I just didn't care.
Care. Like I didn't have to have it with me all the time or whatever. And so it was like this really interesting thing I've just like we are all addicted. He we all say, we're not whatever. When you wake up, you have your phone. When you walk into the room, you go on your computer. Like, whether it's email, phone, calls, social media, whatever, like we are all
addicted. Can I give you one that maybe your mattress guys can work in what kind of emotion? Don't bring your phone in your bedroom? Yeah, I don't do it. I actually leave it outside the bedroom, I usually leave it in the kitchen, but the last thing that you do before you go to bed, should not be
Scrolling you doing scrolling Twitter or to book a whole, you know, just like that, you know, Infinity scrolling until your mind is turning into scrambled eggs and the first thing that you do in the morning should not be whether it's just e mail. Yep. It just should not be that yet. Like it should not be and yet almost everyone before you freaking pee in the morning which is really what you have to do. Yep, you do this thing. So I really, really try not to have this in my
bedroom, very rarely does ever happen. But there's been a couple times. I've woken up to text.
Ages and usually it's like some catastrophic I put that near quotes right? Some catastrophic event happen with like a Founder we've invested or something and they're freaking out and you notice I woke up I was like, pretty chilly. I'm gonna be nine hours on the a screw and then it's just it literally is like, I just got whacked by an 18-wheeler game on. Yeah, and you're like, okay, here we go. And there is this element of like, if you can avoid that, like I do think it's better for you. Yeah. Well, I don't do it. I'm horrible. I don't listen my own advice but like I do, I do agree with
that. So that's my challenge.
Alright, I got to ask you a question. Now I added something podcast. We are not going to further challenge me. No, no, I like that for now. And all you guys have to challenge you as something which is just whatever on the weekends. No fun. You know, the first thing I'm gonna
challenge me, they're going to start bringing me all their coins and tell me to buy it. I already know where that I've seen your
mentions, I don't know what's going on. I've seen your mentions more than I see my mentions. It's
all right. Where can we send people? I feel like everyone knows where you are, but we send people on the
internet. I'm not going to send them to Big Tech. Go to Ruben report dot locals that calm
Rude and
Report dot local
stock and you can create an account a local account for free and you can look around. See what's what? And if you want to interact then it costs a couple bucks but I promise you it will be worth it. But if you just want to see what's what and we're building out some incredibly cool stuff and we're going to agree World
locals. We're going to save the
world. I like that. You're you were like well I did invest. I'm a podcaster. I have to be honest here. You know, this is not something that I'm keeping quiet, you know. Good.
Yeah.
Whatever. I just told truth eligible right? Ruben report. Dot locals.com. That's it. Thank you so much for doing this. Thanks man.
