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Hey everyone. I'm Meghan Kelly. Welcome to the Megyn Kelly show and boy, do we have good news for you? It may be Friday. The 13th with, this is your lucky day on the show. Today. We are focusing on how to help you take ownership of your health and feel your best this summer and ideally shed 5 pounds by Memorial Day. It's a start right? It's a goal, hashtag goals. There's a lot going on in the world right now, but it's important to take a break from the news cycle every once in a while and just take care of yourself. How are you supposed to manage all the
Since coming your way, if you don't feel well, you don't look good. If you don't feel good about how you look with us now to provide a roadmap for getting your nutrition and exercise routine in gear. And I have to tell you, just reading up on this segment, made me feel more devoted to like, okay, come on, stop being lazy. And and I want to go to the grocery store right after this show at 2:00. We're all going to the grocery store and we're going to get new ingredients and we'll go through it. So I think you're going to feel that inspiration. By the time the show is done.
And here to help us do that to New York Times bestselling authors and health, experts. Dr. Kate. Shanahan is a physician biochemist and author of deep nutrition while your genes need traditional food. She also created the pro nutrition program for the Los Angeles, Lakers basketball team. And Mark Sisson is also here. He's a competitive track athlete who spent years as a marathon runner before entering the nutrition and health space. Mark is a fitness author founder of Primal kitchen.
Foods and supplements, by the way, I need to order their salad dressing Abby and author of The Primal blueprint reprogram, your genes for effortless weight loss, vibrant health and Boundless Energy.
Kate mark, thank you so much for being here.
Thanks for inviting us.
So Mark, I say the salad dressing because I know my team said, what do you eat in a typical day? And I was, of course, very interested in this, and I could do it all. Except. The one thing that wasn't on my ingredient list in my kitchen, was your salad dressing. So I'm like, okay, I guess I can be like, Mark if I just order that I will get to that in a minute. Alright. So here we are. I was looking at the calendar. We don't have three weeks to Memorial Day. We've got about two and change, two weeks to Memorial Day. And everybody starts to think about Memorial Day's of
Shall official kickoff to summer. We have to start thinking about our bodies, which is good. It's good because it necessarily sort of dovetails, with our wellness. And what are we putting in our mouths? And what are we doing? The move and all that? So we're going to get into all of it, but overall. Let me start with you. Kate on this. Should we be thinking about jump-starting a diet right now, if we want to lose five to ten pounds, let's just start with something manageable like that. Should we think about a diet?
It. Or should we just be thinking about a way of eating, like a way of life. If you want to lose weight, you really should start in realistically, start with thinking about how you're eating, think about your nutrition and think about your metabolism because there's a reason you've gained weight in the first place. And that probably, I mean, unless, you know, oh gosh, I totally overdid it. Most people feel like, I don't really understand why I am so much weight. Why it happened so quickly and
That's because most people have issues with their metabolism where they're not able to burn their body fat the way nature intended. And that's a serious serious issue that makes weight loss with just a rapid weight. Weight loss diet, a total setup for yo-yo dieting and it's not just bad for your health. It's demoralizing. So I always like to help people to frame it up that we want it to be like a long-term thing. It's
great that you want to look good in your bikini, but it's more important to be well in your bikini and Mickey and your bikini and feel better. And, you know you, if you really want to get healthy, the goal is how you feel much more than first and foremost, how you look just from your metabolism. Sounds amazing. I mean, I we're all worried about our metabolism. Would love it to be a little faster. Everybody. I know especially
People who are now like me in their 50s and you can feel it slow down, you know, for sure. I can feel it slow down not allowed to eat as much but I still want to. It's so so hard. I'm still so hungry all the time. But I know it's slow because the same amount of intake every day. Produces weight gain where it didn't before. So it's just sad, it's just sad, Kate. Well, let me tell you something that and that is actually good news is it is kind of what there's a lot of myths around.
And weight loss and metabolism and it is actually a myth that your metabolism even has speeds and what you expressed is exactly what made people think. Just assume that their metabolism has visas because it feels like it's harder to lose weight and it's become easier to gain, but it has to do with your ability, to bring your body fat, which is something related to metabolic flexibility, which is something that I'm sure Mark can speak to that as well. Just
It means that you need to be able to burn your body fat easily between meals because if you're hungry, you know, that between meals. If you get hungry between meals and you feel like you need to snack. That is a red flag. It's a red flag that you're not burning your body fat. Because if you want to lose weight, then going between meals, should be your best friend. You should be burning your body fat, but most people are not and they're not because their metabolism is damaged by this stuff in our
Diet that we're all eating in massive quantities, called seed oils that nobody has told you are bad for you. I'm So Into the seed oil discussion. We are 100% spending a bunch of time on that because I feel like okay elimination of just the choice of a certain food. That's that's easy, right? You don't have to get rid of all the oils but there are certain oils. We're eating that we shouldn't be. But let me ask you about that Mark. Because when I looked at the Mark diet, one thing I did notice was there are no snacks on there. So to Kate's point is that
Hard. Because I will say for me and I think it's probably because I'm not eating the right stuff. It is very hard for me. Not to snack between lunch and dinner and like you, I'm an intermittent faster. I know you don't eat before noon or 12:30. So I breakfast isn't really on the menu for me most days. Although some days. I have it. Anyway, snacking is really hard for me to avoid. So, how are you are? You don't have that problem. You go. Right from lunch and dinner without having hunger.
Yes, I do that. And, you know, to fill in a little bit of what
Kate said this, this concept of metabolic flexibility. Really is the Holy Grail of not just weight loss. But Health if you can develop metabolic flexibility, if you can train your body through choices of food that you eat and types of exercise, you choose to do. If you can train your body to become metabolically flexible. You can train it to derive energy from whatever substrate happens to be available. So if you eat a meal and there's carbohydrate in that, you can burn the carbohydrates as glucose or as glycogen in your muscles. You can burn the fat in that me Lori.
Burn the stored body fat when you choose not to eat. So metabolic flexibility is, when you achieve kind of that, that state you are now able to go longer periods of time without eating which includes not needing to snack. So this, this you mentioned intermittent fasting. I call it a compressed eating window, some people call it intermittent eating, but it's basically this idea that that when you're metabolically flexible, when you're
so fat, when you're deriving energy from your own body, fat stores, and that's magical, because then you're burning off your body fat. You're literally using it as steel which is what it was intended to do. Then the biggest issue of all starts to dissipate and that is hunger, appetite and Cravings. Once your body knows that it can get energy from stored body fat, and not have to rely on a fresh supply of calories every two or three hours, your body seamlessly goes into this.
Out of burning stored body fat without a shift in blood sugar, without that getting hangry without a mood swings or any of the other sort of symptoms that people complain about when they skip a meal. So, it's now what we're getting into is okay, how how do we arrive at this metabolic? Yes, flexible body.
Yes, how do we teach our bodies? Is very important skill. Of
course, but it's, and it's like, a good news, bad news, right? The good news is, well, I'm sorry.
What about the bad news is you got to do the work, right? You you're going to have to eliminate certain food, you're going to have to orchestrate a way of eating that, you know, that may be different from what you're used to the good news is it's very easy, if you know the right tools, if you have the right strategy, it's easy. It's delicious. I mean, you don't have to really sacrifice taste or flavor for any of this and and over time. What happens is you because you're eating now, more nutrient dense foods.
As opposed to the, you know, the highly caloric dense foods without nutrition that most people in this country are consuming the body then says I've got all of the all the macronutrients I need. I've got all of that protein and carbohydrate. I've got a little micro nutrition. I need. I don't need to eat every couple of hours. And so, the first thing that really I find disappears is this need to snack between meals and that's kind of step one of this notion.
That in order to get rid of our stored body fat in order to lose weight, which is what, you know, most people will describe it as we need to burn off the, the body fat that we've stored over the years, as a result of eating too much food. Simply eating too much food.
How did he like as a practical matter? How did do you train your body to to eat the fat that's on your body as opposed to whatever fuel you put in your body? Because
If you eat, let's say breakfast, or you eat lunch, that food takes a while to digest that energy is in your body. So isn't your body necessarily going to eat that fuel? That fuel first? Those carbs, those proteins, those fats before it goes to your body fat? Like, I always wonder how do I make it get to the body fat and get past the food that I had to put in there? Mark,
what do you have to? You have to withhold some of those?
Energy substrates, you have to decide either? Not to eat like to skip a meal once in a while too too fast, or there's a diet based around the ketogenic principle. So you and I've written a couple of books on the keto diet, which is a way of training your body, to become what we call Fat adapted. So, once you withhold carbohydrate and now you're telling your body, hey, you're not going to be getting all of the glucose that we've been feeding you every two or three hours.
Last 20 or 30 or 50 years. Now, we're going to have to go into Plan B, which everybody has this. This blueprint in their body. Everybody has the ability to build the metabolic Machinery to be better at burning fat. We just never give it the opportunity. So that's part of that work that I'm talking about. There are no real hats around this. You will have to, in order to develop metabolic flexibility. You will have to selectively, remove certain things from your diet. It may be
And I think most of us know removing sugars is probably appropriate for just about everybody. We wait too much sugar would say, removing starchy processed carbohydrates. Mostly processed grains, pies cakes, cookies crackers, cereals things like that, remove them and as K, alluded earlier you come down to a list of very healthy and Natural Foods. Meat, fish, fowl, eggs, nuts, seeds, vegetables, some fruit, some starchy tubers and overtime.
When the brain gets the notion that you're not going to be delivering it fresh glucose every two or three hours breakfast, snack, lunch, snack dinner and a midnight snack. The body has all of these amazing genetics, which is that it turns on that says, okay. We're going to get ready to burn more fat. We never had to before now, but now we're going to get ready to burn more of the stored body fat and call upon those reserves. He's energy reserves that we've been building up for years.
Years and and burn those instead of the plate on the food. So when you say, you know, how do you train your body to burn the fat as opposed to the breakfast? I say, don't eat the breakfast. If you wake up in the morning and you're not hungry, there's no reason to eat breakfast. Breakfast is, you know, it's been sold as the most important meal of the day. It's not. And most of the people who get into this idea of metabolic flexibility or compressed eating window will say
If I, if I, if I wake up with all the energy I need, why would I need to eat? This is an opportunity for my body to get 500 calories from body fat between now and the first meal. I have it maybe lunch or one o'clock noon at
15. Okay, but now I know and I know you write a lot about this to about plateauing Kate because I will say that and I want to get stay broad, but I'll just as a quick aside. I've been an intermittent faster for a while and it worked great in the beginning to take off.
Off, you know, just the extra flab here and there and I've never been one of those like bone skinny people. But then, you know, fine. I was fine with and I'm still fine with where I am, but then I do think, I sort of plateaued and even now, if I go hardcore on the fat and the intermittent fasting, you know, because I'll cheat, I'll have like a couple crackers, which I know you're not supposed to do whatever. But let's say, it's Summers coming. I so I go hardcore. It's not changing anything. I think I'm a plateau, our and I know
Dealt with that issue. Yes, actually quite a bit. It's one of the most frustrating things that people run into and there's always a reason for it and I usually like to just back up and give you the big picture of getting back to, what we were talking about with with snacking snacking, trains your metabolism for you to want more snacks. So, it's an incredibly dangerous habit because people don't realize
Is how many calories they actually consume when they're wandering around going? Oh, just have a little bit of this. And I'll just have a little bit of that, and many people have doing that have two or three times more calories. So 200 400 600 more calories. Just from these little snacks that they pick up. And that is why I say, there is no such thing as a healthy snack, because it's not a healthy habit, even if you're eating a healthy food during your snack, it
Habit of snacking is not healthy because snacking trains your metabolism to wait for you to get another snack. Instead of doing what it should do, which is burning your body fat. Mmm, but the other thing I want to go to the bat on my body. Don't go to my thighs, don't wait for the carrots or the beef jerky. If you've been eating seed oils, the fat that's in your body fat has changed because of that. And and this is why I wrote a different book, an entirely different.
The book also for weight loss, called the fat burn fix, because I realized at a certain point in my career. I realized that what people had been telling me about their struggles with weight. What you? No. Like, I understood that it was it wasn't making sense to them and it wasn't making sense to me, either. They would say I hardly eat anything and I'm not losing weight. I work out all the time and it used to work, but now it doesn't anymore. Something is wrong with my metabolism? And I
Yeah, there is something wrong with your metabolism. It took me quite a bit to figure out exactly what. But what it was was that their body fat was damaged by all these seed oil. So seed, oils are things like soy and corn. Do you want me to list out what they are? Yes, because these are the devil, like a people should know. Dr. Kate feels that seed oils are the devil and that if we can stop eating them and she's got good Alternatives. It's going to be so much easier for us to lose weight. So this is
Ali really important, it's not just about, this is not as heart-healthy. It's about, these are undermining your ability to lose weight and feel great. Okay. Go ahead. These I call them the hateful eight because there's eight of them. There's three C's, corn, canola cottonseed, 3, s's soy sunflower, safflower and g&y like, sometimes, why grape seed and and rice bran with the vowels, so there's eight of them. Everybody should memorize Italy.
The first six because those are in 95% of the products with an ingredients list that you buy in the typical grocery store. Even if you shop at fancy grocery stores, the upscale ones like Trader Trader, Joe's, and Whole Foods to name names if we can do that. Yeah. Wait, let me just let me just repeat what you said, canola corn, cotton seed. Soy sunflower safflower grapeseed rice. Bran. What did I miss? I think I'm at 7:00. So I miss one. I thought you got eight.
I did make up a little song for it. But yes, good don't. Yes, I do. Okay, so if corn canola cottonseed soy sunflower, safflower, please carefully carefully, carefully, carefully, read, labels, and avoid all of these. I'm not a good singer, but the I can handle the row. Your boat. Look how she cares audience liked. How she cares about this, did it? I appreciate that. All right, so
Those do you don't want those. I notice that olive oil is not on the list. I mean, is all of what you don't do, you like olive oil cause that's what most people use.
Olive oil is a traditional oil in Italy. Ask anyone from you know, Italy or Greece or most of the not the Middle East when they call that somewhere. I drink the Mediterranean. Thank you. I've never been there. But um, yeah, so all of those Mediterranean Cuisines, they rely heavily on olive oil. Olive oil has been used for many many, thousands of years. And the reason that's important is because people cultivate what they want. So we've cultivated olives that are high in fat.
And that has so many benefits. Not only is the fat itself healthy and full of vitamins. When you do first, press olive oil, you're getting all of those vitamins and you're getting the the healthiest form of oil. But it's been cultivated to be so rich in it that you just need gentle pressing with a stone. That's the traditional way that they did it. Gentle pressing. No Factory required to get out a whole bunch of great tasting oil. So that history is really important and you're going to find if you go to my website and
Look at my list of the good fats in the bad that it's the traditional fats that are on the good list and that I'm so. Lord is on there. I was like Lord, how can lard be better than sunflower oil?
Doesn't sound right.
I know it's crazy. Actually it took me a few more years before I was comfortable. Even saying the word lard like without like apologizing for it because it was just like it's like a four letter word right in the American language, but but yeah, it is a tradition.
All traditional we've cultivated pigs to be fatty pigs. We've bred them for so many thousands of generations of pigs that they are there. Like, we bred them literally to be a little like walking butter sticks. And I'm walking little butterball's and they they are, they are basically a huge source of healthy fat for people all over the globe because pigs made their way all over the all over the globe. So, yes, lard is a healthy fat and
And you know, the reason that these things are not toxic has to do with the fatty acid composition, and that's like chemistry that we don't necessarily need to get into, but understanding the fatty acid composition is key. Really to ultimately be coming to understand the difference between fats that are healthy, that sustain your energy between meals, that make not snacking. Be like your default because you don't get
Right. You don't get hangry when your body fat, your body fat stores these fatty acids, and that's why it's. So it was essential for me to understand this chemical difference in the way. Our body processes, these different fatty acids in order to be able to explain what was happening. Truly happening to people's metabolisms and that it wasn't slowing down. It was just losing its efficiency. It was not able to efficiently. Go as Mark was saying from burning the calories in the food.
That you just last 8 to snap immediately into releasing your body fat from storage and burning that. And when that happens to you, you feel like weight loss is a bigger struggle. Because you feel bad, when you're burning your body fat. You need to burn your body fat to lose weight. But what's in your body fat is from those toxic seed, oils, and that starts to make your cells dysfunction. So
Start to feel kind of tired or cranky, you get brain fog, you get hangry, we have so many people using the word hangry now, and it wasn't even a word. Like, when I was in school Mark, like, did you ever hear that word when you were growing up?
Why only the last 10 years? Maybe? Yeah. Yeah, this
is so I can I can relate to all this you're saying it's because it's basically it's like we had on a guest recently explaining to us how Mercury can stay in your cells and you know, some say oh no, it'll go, it'll leave but no it might be
Lurking in there and you could get sick from it for a long, long time. That's kind of what you're saying about these bad oils. They're in there. And when we're telling the body, eat the fat, eat the fat, it's it's eating the fat, but the fat is kind of toxic, and that's making us feel bad. So we can make our fat healthier will enjoy the non-eating periods, more. They won't be quite as hard. They'll actually be glorious because what happens when you go long enough between meals? Is that your liver starts chopping up?
The big fat into little tiny special things called ketones which are your brains, favorite fuel. They actually energize you and when you get to this state, you feel so energetic, you feel better. You feel like I don't want to eat and that is why the, the having a healthy metabolism in a flexible metabolism is the key to truly effortless weight loss. It's actually the only key. I mean, there's all kinds of drugs you could take and all kinds of
people promising this or that supplement, but really the key is optimizing your metabolic health. So that your, your, your liver will produce ketones for your brain and that EVP fat burning machine. Okay. Now, I want to say that you, you like the following oils. You say, eat these instead avocado butter fats, avocado butter. Coconut. Duck fat guy lard, which we covered Olive. Peanut Tallow sesame.
Walnut, almond and macadamia nut anything that says cold pressed and this is critical. Everybody unrefined. It has to say unrefined but here's my question to you. So all of us can do that, you know, when I'm cooking dinner tonight, I can definitely use lard. It'll be fun to buy that at the store or but I have a olive oil so I can do that. But you're you've raised a bigger point which is virtually everything in your pantry has already got all the bad stuff in it, like don't
Go in your pantry. I mean it's funny because I'll tell you a kid. Mark i-i've been one of my listeners pointed this out to me recently. Last June 12. I made a resolution to try to go one year without having a french fry because
there they were becoming a problem
for me. I was just not able to exercise will power on them and I'm almost there and I've done it, right? And we're like a month away and a guy from Israel called into the show like a week or two ago and said I decided to do it with you because I invited my followers on Twitter to do it with me and he said I've been doing
I'm and I'm successful. And what are you going to give up this June 12th, and I've been thinking about it ever since I like the idea of like a supposed to January 1st. I'm just going to make June 12th. My day were like for a year, I decide. Like, what could I do? We, it's a test of will power and I feel like originally I was like, give up the pantry. I want to ask your opinion on what I should give up at like everything you just listed is all over my pantry. I don't think I'd be able to avoid it and everybody out. There's in
The same boat Kate. So what what do they do? How do they avoid? It's in Breads and crackers and everything. So, actually on my website, I have a shopping list that helps people find alternative products that don't have seed oils. And one of my favorite companies is actually founded by far that way, that way because he uses avocado oil and especially like mayo and the dressings, right? Because when you're eating healthy, you don't want your
Salad, dressing or the, you know, the sauce is that you put on your Healthy vegetables at your healthy meals. You don't want that to be full of toxic fats and most people have no idea that that's actually what they're doing. Because because, you know, most of the sauces that are come in jars and most of the condiments are just made out of the cheapest possible stuff that the companies can find, which is always going to be the hateful, eight boils. So yeah, so the so you can find more and more products. It is possible, but you have to know what you're looking for. You have to know to do this.
This, you have to know to do it, right? Like, that's the first step is, you need to know you need to do this. The second step is to follow me again, decide that you're going to do it with her. Because if she can do it, you can probably do it, right? So you so you remember, okay, you like unrefined you, like unrefined you don't like anything that says hydrogenated or any of those hateful eight. Don't go for hydrogenated, go for unrefined. We're going to take a quick break, but for the people who are just, you know, listening to this right now. Can you give me the website because they're going
No, dr. Kate.com DRC aate.com. And then just go to the search bar and type shopping, because you'll, you'll find it that way. I'm sorry about for climate search within an hour and a half. I will be doing this and then marks got some thoughts to not just on diet, but on some of the supplements that may make sense for you when it comes to metabolism and to metabolic flexibility. I like that new term.
Mark, I've heard this before. But can you help us? Understand? What does it mean
to remove
sugar and starches? His, it seems so hard and I wrote, I just ticked down what I could remember what you said. I'm going to go back and listen to it later. Pies cakes crackers, cereals, single tear. I love my crackers. I can probably handle the rest. I love McGregor. So what do you mean? Because removing sugar seems absolutely impossible.
Sybil. I never understand what someone's like I gave up sugar. It's like,
wow, it's pretty daunting for sure. And the truth is, you know, our brains are wired to seek out sweet things. So it's one of the reasons that were attracted to fruit. For instance, fruit is sweet. And by the way, very enjoyable and very healthy in the appropriate quantities. So I'm not advocating giving up fruit for instance, but it's interesting. All of these things. We're going to talk about today exists on a spectrum of like, really good to
Really, really terrible. Fats are a great example, you know, there are really terrible fats you want to avoid at all costs and then there are really good fats that you want to incorporate in your diet because they're healthful and they taste great and they're satiating well with sweets. There's a similar sort of spectrum. So we want to get rid of, you know, the processed sweeteners, the sugars, the you know, table sugar Agave is a great example of something. It was sold as a
Is a health food kind of thing. It's basically worse than high fructose corn syrup. We've all heard. Oh my God, iphicles corn. Syrup is on the other hand, some amount of Honey because it's natural is probably fine for some people. So this idea of giving up sweets, really has to kind of look more closely at what exactly it is. You're willing to give up and and what is practical in the in the context of an eating strategy that you're putting together for yourself. So, you know, getting rid of
desserts would be a great first step for a lot of people. I always thought dessert was kind of a weird. It's like the meal you eat after you've just eaten a meal and it desert has a pretty devastating effect in most cases on, you know, on your insulin level. So when you are trying to lose weight, one of the things you want to do is keep your insulin levels low, because insulin is what locks fat into the fat cells. So that's one of the reasons whenever you eat something that has cards in it, whether starchy carbs.
Whether it's, you know, bread or crackers, for example, it'll tend to cause your insulin to go up and insulin. Is there as a hormone that's intended to sequester nutrients into cells. So we'll open the cells up and try to try to put the glucose portion of that into into muscle cells, for instance, as glycogen, but it will also Drive amino acids into other cells, which is protein, but it will also Drive fat in a cell's if in
Salinas High, so you want to try and overtime, lower the amount of insulin you produce and that kind of goes hand-in-hand with the amount of sugar that you take in. So now sort of good news. You can buy some some slack as quote Quito and quote crackers. So there you can get that crunchy, salty, fatty sweet taste without writing that down. Yeah, so,
There are now analogs of some of these things that we're going to ask you to give up. And there are there been Paleo Desserts and keto desserts for years. I think it's a sort of an Abomination at some point because a lot of times they use some of these ingredients that we're talking about avoiding, but if, but giving up giving up, sugar is, is the tough one for a lot of people. On the other hand. We're not really addicted to Sugar, people say they're addicted to sugar. And, you know, I think that the definition of an
Action is something that if you don't get it, you'll go into, you know, a biochemical reaction that will sweat. You'll, you know, you'll you'll go into pain or whatever. That's true addiction. So what we haven't in most cases is first of all, unlimited access, the sweet things, they're everywhere. And then what I call a lack of impulse control, they're everywhere. And oh my goodness. They're in the pantry or they're in the freezer that frozen chocolate in the freezer. Or I've got one of the best things you can do for yourself is do what we call a pan.
You purge and just go through and and take away that Temptation, which isn't to say that you should go hungry or that you should suffer or feel like you're sacrificing enjoyment of your life in pursuit of this better eating. That was just to find things that will replace those that are more helpful for you.
And with that, we have to talk about the replacement. So I will say right now with young children. This sounds impossible, you know, they you know, you know,
No, right. Like you know what's on my shelf without even me telling you because I have 8 11 and 12 year old and not to mention what's in my freezer. And I know we could say well, get rid of the ice cream, or get rid of the chocolate chips, or get rid of the cookies is like, there would be a full-on Revolt in my house if I okay, so we'll get to that. But but how does somebody start that? Because you say, stop with the desert, that's a good place to start. You know, there are a lot of people who are, like, I can't do that. Like I need it. I need it. So
To that person. What does that person do tonight? When the Habit is there to eat the dinner and then have the desert? And now it's go time. You ate the dinner and all the instincts inside of you are kicking in. Like now it's my time for my treat. What do they
do? Well, there are a number of strategies. One of the one of them would be to recognize that. It's human nature to see what we can get away with, right. So we we we see how, you know, how much this meal. Can I eat and not gain weight. How much food can I?
In a day and not gain weight before the wedding three months. What's the biggest piece of dessert that I can eat and not feel like a glutton, you know, or be too uncomfortable. So we come at it from from a what can I get away with perspective? Rather than how much of this is going to satisfy this week tooth. And so, the first thing I would say to some people is you can serve the giant piece of cheesecake and your brain is going. Well. That's a serving. So it's not like I'm having two servings on.
Been a serving, even though it's a Cheesecake Factory 1800 calories of piece of it. I would say, you know, take the first bite and enjoy the hell out of it and love it and, and savor it. And then take the second byte and recognize it. It's great, but it wasn't as good as the first. And usually, with most Desserts, by the time you get to the third or fourth white, you go. You know what I got it. I got the sense. I got the sweetness from this point on. I'm just having having a contest with myself to see whether am. I glad
And or or not. So first first thing would be to just cut back and just see if you can limit yourself to to b or three bites of of ice cream or something like that or whatever it is that you're poison. It's so much easier though to just say if I have room for dessert, then I have room for another lamb chop. So I'll skip the desert and have another lamb chop or another chicken wing or another whatever. Whatever it is you had for dinner. That's actually providing protein.
In some form, a healthy fat and some in the case of a chicken wing. Some some collagen, you know, whatever. That's the way I would approach this. And that's when I said it's you know, the good news, bad news. And the bad news is you have to do the work. That's part of the work. The good news is you can find things. I mean, my life, the favorite dessert that my wife ever serves people, when we have a dinner party is mixed berries with marscapone cheese and whipped cream. So it is berries, which
I say our tarp fruits, which I'm allowing as a, as a something to address, your sweet tooth and the marsh Capone, and the in the whipped cream together. With a little bit of lemon zest. It's unbelievable. So people say it's the best dessert they've ever had. When they come to my house and these are people are used to pies and cakes everything else. So there are some substitutes this Alternatives that will address the Sweet Tooth part of you without having you say, all I have to give up the rest of my life and I can't, I can't, I can't enjoy food ever again.
No, and Kate will agree with me on this. I mean, we Kate and I eat like kings and queens. I enjoy every bite of food. I put my mouse so ice not like I'm ever feeling. Like I'm sacrificing. I just choose foods that are a good for me and be. I know I'm going to love and love to taste and when you prepare them right with the right sauces dressings, toppings, that's why I started my company, Primal kitchen, you know, I if I'm going to make a giant salad, I don't want to ruin it with cannoli.
Loyal or soybean oil or any of that other stuff. I want to. I want to enhance the experience of the flavor of it with the dressing. And I want to enhance the healthfulness of it with the dressing. So you can have, you can have both of those. I was going to say you can have your cake and eat it too. I haven't you cannot. I will say
just for anecdotally it sometimes it helps me to avoid because my kids love dessert, my husband loves dessert, and I also occasionally like dessert. But if I just go for, like a tea, I like this apple cinnamon tea that it's, you know, you just put it in and it doesn't need
Milk and doesn't need sugar. It seems like a treat and is something warm and it takes a while and it keeps you sort of away from them while they're eating their treat. You know, that moment that you're most vulnerable, when everyone's unwrapping their, their Popsicle or, you know, spooning in their ice cream. So, for whatever that's worth, Kate. I know you share the aversion to refined flours, refined flours, but I have to tell you what, I don't even know what that means and I feel like I've been fairly exposed to this.
World, but even I sitting I like bread, I mean, what does, what does that look like?
Flower. So whether it comes from wheat or spelt or any other kind of thing that's been pulverized into a fine powder. That is something that is very processed and because of that, it has almost no nutrition and it's pretty much empty calories, but you're correct in that. I do tell people to be aware of these things, but I don't tell people that they have to avoid them 100%. I'm I'm you know, I'm not in the All or Nothing.
Up. It's not like having a little bit of something. Sets your metabolism back and some kind of, you know, horrible way. No, it's those both refined sugars which basically just means, you know, table sugar, something else like granulated sugar or something, is basically pure sugar like corn syrup or agave. Nectar, the things that Mark was listing, brown sugar, all of those sugars are basically mostly empty calories because they're so processed and there are so, so,
So like addicting because they raise our blood sugar and their addicting in a way that you're the that we haven't talked about yet. But that gives you energy. There's a metabolic addiction that does happen when your body's when you've been eating seed oils. So there's a lot that I just said that I want to unpack a little bit. So first of all, I say, you know, you can have granulated sugar. You don't have to do funny things where you like and you have like some room date paste instead or, you know, peace, honey from
From anointed B's, you know, in the Himalayas you can have links, sugar is sugar. Once you've digested, broken it down and it's gotten into your bloodstream. It's identical at that chemical level. Your body. Can't tell the difference. But you want to get a handle on how much you're having, because it's so easy to overeat the stuff and so you want it like, you know, plan it ahead and to answer your question of, how do you deal with this? Like, how do you control sugar? How do you
Make it so that you're in control of how much sugar you eat, not whatever you happen to have in the cupboards, or even your children, who want you to keep stuff in the covers. And, and the answer is, there are two strategies and Mark, you did a great job of summarizing one of the two strategies strategies, which is like the mindset, right? Your mindset about, you know, focusing on dinner, right? Like, what I do to myself, is I look forward to dinner and I know we're going to have a good
Dinner and I'm like, all about the dinner. If I was just imagine what it would be like if I was like, I just want to Breeze through dinner so I can get to something sweet tasting for desserts my eight-year-old approach to life. That's what gets you just outlined his entire nutritional approach and that's how I like violently ninety percent of Americans. Think about dinner is like something we have to get through so that we can eat the ice cream that we really are, you know, really wanting they get. Get get through all this stuff. Sure. Yeah, I like burgers.
Sure, I like pizza. But really what I want is cookies. So that is you have that because you've been thinking that way for so long. So it's ingrained in your mindset. It's a habit. But you also have a metabolic problem there. And that's the whole other strategy that that like I think is the most important part of what is why I wrote the book, The fat burn fix, because there's a lot going on with our metabolisms.
Of these seed oils that makes our brains need sugar. So we are addicted. Not just to The Taste, which is what everyone knows. It's addicting taste. You need, you have a little sugar, you want a little more sugary. It's like any other drug and that is all true. But the other part of this, that is so important to understand your relationship with food is that if you have too much seed, oils in your body fat, which everyone does, unless you've been avoiding them. You are your brain thinks that
Sugar equates to energy because your brain does not trust your body fat. Your brain. Says, I don't want to anybody to be burning body fat because when that happens, I don't, I feel bad. And so that your brain now equates sugary things with energy and that makes it very hard for willpower to use, your will power to control how much you're eating. So you have to get to that underlying metabolic cause and understand how to handle that. And and that's where the healthy fats are key.
and knowing learning how to build meals meals, that sustain your energy, so you don't want to snack and healthy fats as one big piece of it, but the other big piece are kind of like the complicated carbohydrates or the, the high glycemic, the low glycemic index carbohydrates that the starchy foods that are not refined things, like beans starchy vegetables, a kind of bread that is made the old-fashioned way the way they used to do, and the
Today's called sprouted grain bread. They don't make make it out of flour. You can make it that you can get that at, I think Whole Foods, right? Was a Dave's. I'm trying to remember, it's a freezing zekiel. Ezekiel is the best. Like Dave Dave makes a Dave, has a brand to you, but I've tested people's blood sugar's after they eat Dave's. And after they eat Ezekiel and it's better with Ezekiel because what happened is he kills just more pure sprouted grain. Whereas Dave seems to have some more flour in it or something and it spikes your blood sugar.
And that spiking of blood sugar is not a good thing. Because every time you spike your blood sugar over a certain level, you're exposing all your tissues and your joints too much sugar. And it basically, it's like sugar in your joints is like rust in an engine. It is, it makes them sticky and it's the last thing that you want. So, so spiking your blood sugar is bad, but it doesn't mean you have to give up bread or all starchy carbohydrate. E things. It just means you want to eat those that your body breaks down.
On more slowly. So I call them the slow-digesting carbohydrates because the technical term is low glycemic, but doesn't really mean anything. So slow digesting the things that break down slow like beans, actual beans, carrots. Those have some carbon in them to not potatoes because they're so that we, we bump our blood sugar pretty quick with those, but pretty much every other, like whole food. That's a little bit. Starchy breaks down, very slowly. And in your
And is a great way to sustain your energy between meals. That's what I was getting at. Those. It really helps. You not snack. You have to know all the strategies to not want to snack because there's when your metabolism is is like refusing to burn your body fat. You really have to build meals in a smart way so that you don't get that, hangry between meals, hangry is an example of how you feel, because your brain is addicted to energy the energy and sugar and
And can't use your body fat. Hangry is an abnormal metabolic State and and that's why I teach people how to get rid of that. Hangry feeling. What are you going to do? What are you going to eat? Step by step? Because it's quite a it takes a bit of learning really to be able to get to that point where you can finally lose weight effortlessly. Now, this reminds me of her comment. Kate's comment Dave about remark about, you know, just
You can have some sugar just make sure it's small. I read that you start your day with some french, press, heavy cream in your coffee. Same. By the way. I heard that trip that tracking it. I love it and monk fruit. Sweetener. So now, are you embarrassed that you're having monk fruit sweetener and
staff. You know, I sometimes I use Mumford. Sometimes you use a teaspoon of table sugar who, you know, that the devil is Kate said, it's, it's one of these things where it's not about, it's not about
It's the dose that makes the poison, right? And a little bit of sugar isn't going to derail you and it's not going to put you, you know, your metabolism out of kilter. I have a real issue with rains. It was probably the most revolution revolution revolutionary thought that I had 25 years ago, changed my life entirely. When I realized that that my my arthritis that I had my IBS, my irritable bowel syndrome. My getting sick many times a year was largely due to my intake.
Of grains. I was a marathoner triathlete. And so I was always looking to take an extra card before I knew how inflammatory my diet was and through the years. I was taking in bread and pasta and cereal and beer. And, you know, all forms of carbs. It came from grain. And when I finally eliminated the grains, everything that had been bothering me in my in terms of my health. Cleared up went away. So I realized
Number one, how antithetical grains are to actual health. And the fact that the US Department of Agriculture listed them, as the preferred fuel source, the 6 to 11 servings per day at the base of the food. I found that
we've been misled. I got to squeeze in a quick quick commercial, but I why we have to talk about grains because that's like all the rage. Mark. We left off at grains, and I know you're a big fan of Quito.
Some of our viewers may have some of the folks on Twitter to weigh in like, what questions do you have? And one of our guests wrote in this is from Nathan, one of our fans high-fiber diet. Yay, or nay Mediterranean diet versus keto, you're a big fan of Quito and not of grain, so go on.
Well, so so I'm a fan of Quito. I employ the strategies of Quito once in a while. I don't engage in a regular ketogenic diet because to be frank, I
Like eating food, I like eating a variety of foods and some of the things that would not be allowed on the ketogenic diet. I want to consume them once in a while. And so I do grains in my estimation and there's been a lot of written about about how antithetical grains can be to health are basically a cheap source of calories for most people around the world. And you know, when people don't have access to food of any kind grains, can be a lifesaver for us the United States, we have access to much more healthful Foods.
So grains, I mean, I refer to them as beige glop, that you have to put stuff on to make it taste great. You know, if you have dry toast, isn't that great? You got to put jam on it or butter bowl of spaghetti with nothing on it is not that appealing. You got to you got to have the marinara sauce or whatever. And I just say, why don't you just wear a bowl of the marinara sauce? So, you know having said that, you know, the smell of a yeasty bread coming out of the oven is pretty appealing. So once in a while, even
In though, I keep bread and other grain products out of my diet, for the most part, every once in a while. I'll have a couple of taste, a couple of bites of bread with a lot of butter on it, because I want that experience. So, this is it's a, it's a situation where, you know, you craft the ideal diet for it for you, which includes what's best for you in terms of food, you know, that you should not be eating. But also to, you know, to include a variety of foods that you want to try, you want to taste, make your make your life.
Enjoyable, I mean, as I said earlier, every bite of food, I eat, I want it to taste fabulous. I don't want to cut it because he made me kale salad with with, you know, lemon juice dressing on into this. The most helpful thing. You could eat, Mark, I'd say no. No, thanks. Take it away. Thank you.
All right. So let's talk. I've been, I've tease the audience long enough. Let's talk about your what you eat in a day. I talked about your coffee in the morning. Can you just spend 20 seconds on why heavy cream
just makes the coffee tastes a little better. It's full fat. So I'm, you know, I'm a fan of consuming.
An appropriate amount of saturated fat, so it's a great way to start the day with a little bit of a dollop of fat. If you will, and my coffee. It's just the right taste combination for me. Again. I want to enjoy that cup of coffee for lunch. I typically have some kind of fish, usually this for variety. I'll have salmon or tuna, or two. Tuna, Sashimi, a little bit of vegetables. I become less and less enamored of vegetables we can talk about what that what that looks like in the context of fiber. For instance.
And then, for dinner, I'll usually have a steak or had lamb chops last night with steamed broccoli, glass of red wine. I'm very happy camper with that kind of a heating. So there's no starch because, you know, the
traditional American dinner plate, has a protein, a veggie, and a starch, you know, whether it's rice or couscous or a little bit of pasta or something, right? Like, are you getting so to people who worry? Well, I'm not, I'm not going to be full enough with just a pork chop and some broccoli. What say you?
Well, first of all, the
The pork chop with its fat and protein content is very satiating. It's probably almost people would need to be to be you say full, you don't need to add a layer of potatoes or rice or anything like that on to that and the vegetables can take up space as well and it's a little bit of fiber. But I'm in that camp right now. That I don't think you need. That one's fiber. I think the reason that your microbiome works. Well is because you're feeding it the right sorts of substrates and so forth.
If you're a carnivore, you'd say well how do these people even go to the bathroom right out of even have a bowel movement. Well, because their microbiome the bacteria in their gut do very well on the gelatinous material in the in the state. They're reading or in the animal protein in there eating and can convert those into the short-chain fatty acids that they need. So you don't really need fiber and you certainly don't need this cut. This concept of scouring your colon with fiber. That's too long.
We do it. So, talk to me about the wine because I saw something about I didn't actually understand the note. Dry Farm wine selection. What is it? What's
that? Well, I think dry Farm wife is a company that provides a curated wines from around the world. I didn't mean this do an advertising for them. But that's, that's who I use. Same. Hey, yeah, but there are there are companies like them who will find wines that are old country. Old-growth, wines that. Don't have any sugar in them. So,
Most American wines, have a lot of sugar. Some wines in the US have more sugar than Coca-Cola.
Yeah, my doctor just reminded me. He said you and your husband share a bottle of wine at night. That's like having a bottle of grape juice. Remember
that angle. Well, it doesn't have to be because there are a lot of wines from around the world, mostly not the u.s. That have no, like less than a half a gram of sugar per bottle that have, none of the additives that are allowed the US, and none of the sort of histamine. Yeah, and they're good.
Fantastic, I prefer them now to the old big thick fat chocolatey leathery California, cabs that I used to eat. It's okay. So why stay there was something I used to eat them. But but yeah, so I enjoy a glass of wine with dinner. I mean, I get, I want to enjoy my meal. I want to enjoy every bite of food. I eat, and I craft my eating strategy around long periods of not eating where I'm living my life and not worrying about missing a meal or the energy that I
Get some that meal because I have all the energy I want. And then when I sit down to a meal, I'm like very thankful. Very grateful tastes great. It's one of the better experiences of my day.
Now, I know Kate. You say don't buy. We've heard like at the fat-free thing was nonsense, but I but you say don't buy low fat, don't buy low cholesterol. Don't buy fat-free food. Don't buy skim milk, like all the stuff that's had the fat taken out of, it was wrong. Exactly. And and they do that so that they can
Kind of sell you the fat back to you twice, like they make money twice right? That they sell you to skim milk and the skim skim yogurt. That's got extra sugar in their sugars, very cheap, but to make ice cream and cream and those kinds of Confections that where you really need butter that they want to keep that to use that separately, but it also helps make you hungry all the time so that you're more likely to snack. So it really benefits the food companies and most people bastards. Yeah. It's a, yeah, they've been to thank you. They get you coming and going
Really good at that. I wanted to just touch a little tiny bit on on grains. Like, I don't, I don't think anybody's really saying that grains are toxic. It's just that they're easy to overeat. And I actually use flour to make one of the most delicious liver dishes ever. I'm actually, I'm lying. I don't do it. My husband does it, and he dredges the liver and flour and it just comes out. So unbelievably good. I never thought I would actually look forward to a meal with liver.
Birkhäuser and that is one part of the Kate, Shanahan plan that I'm like, I don't know if I can do it, because Kate loves for things. She loves meat on the bone. Organ Meats. Hello, liver, fermented, and sprouted foods and fresh uncooked ingredients, you know, raw, she says those are inflammation, Fighters and antioxidants. I can do that. I can do, you know, raw vegetables but like organ Meats. Kate, come on, how are we supposed to do that? Yeah, it takes some dedication. But if you really, if you literally can't do it, then you can get pretty similar.
Nutrient profile from egg yolks if the eggs are like pasture-raised and, you know, we're free-ranging. So they were eating like a normal chicken diet with the like, including some bugs and some fresh greens and stuff like that. Not just the grain stuff. But but there are so many liver recipes out there that like liver and onions when you do it, right? It's actually really good. So that's why I say, yeah, it's kind of want to because you're going to try it a few times and there's always the smell of the
House, is it disgusting like the first time or you're like, oh, I'm not going to be able to do it or is it like actually this is getting a bad rap? Yeah. It's a really good question. It has almost no smell. Like, it's the only thing that's smelly about it is like what you coat on it, right? Or what, you put it in or the bacon, that you're cooking it with or the, the onions that you're caramelizing, or charring. And what do you ask about your for the smell? What do you, what do you order? How do you get liver? We got, I go to a kind of a small little farm store.
They have grass fed cows, and it's, they're sold Frozen, and a pack. Like so, when you saw that, it's always there. They're like you had no problem. We have tons of it. Kate. Yeah, it's because well, you know, it's if you think about it, the cows have livers, right? So they don't want to throw them out. So and if there's a farm that there's nearby, they got us all those levers that we sell every part. They want to make money off of every single part of the can. But I know you, I know you also see, you can try, you can do the liver pate which actually is somewhat stomach able. So,
So there you like the organ meat? And can you talk for a minute about meat on the bone and bone marrow? When I was in France? Recently that was an order. You could order bone marrow. I'm like, what is that? I know people. This is a trend now, but why do people want to eat bone marrow? So there are the four things that you talked about Meghan are I call them the four pillars of the human diet because they're common to every single traditional cuisine around the world and they include the
The fresh food and the furnace brought us food and the meat on the bone and the organ Meats. So meat on the bone. Let's break that down because meat on the bone provides you something that's really good for your skin, for your hair, for your nails, and your joints. It gives you collagen and a whole bunch of other stuff that only come from. When you take an animal and you boil its joint material or its skin. It releases these very special compounds that are basically missing from the American diet.
It there, including collagen peptides people heard of college and now but glucosamine and glycosaminoglycans. Those are other chemicals that you get. When you make just good old-fashioned like chicken soup, where you include the bones, the tendons, the Skins, you know, when you have a chicken say, for example, that white stuff on the ends of the bones and the like the wiggly, white ligaments and tendons grow stuff. This full of new for you been and so you're saying, when you go to the grocery store,
Instead of getting like the pre-trimmed chicken breast, that we all go for because it seems like cleaner and easier go for like, the chicken legs. The thighs with the bones. Yes, and just bake them or fry. Them are just, you know, they actually taste so much better just easy in prepared and easy ways because the breast has had the fat in the skin. Removing those things taste really great when you crisp them up and fry them up. And this fills your house up with this beautiful.
Fried Chicken smell that and those have extremely potent, nutrients, that help your skin, your hair, and your nails that are related to collagen and they build your collagen. All of those things. I just mentioned, skin hair nails and joints and bonds that are made mostly out of collagen. And the meat on the bone. Aspect of the four pillars helps fortify those collagen Rich tissues, and there's no other way to do it. Because like, I mean, you can take supplements. Yes, but,
They are not as effective as the real thing and it's kind of why I say it's like a missing food group from the American diet because we don't do that. We use Boolean to make soup. So don't do that. Just save the bones and and make your own chicken stock or you can buy boxed, bone stock now really easily. It's at every grocery store. You can get from Amazon's great deal at Costco. And I'm so much better as a base for your soup. Gives it so much flavor than just using water and it's
So much better for you than Boolean because the bouillon cubes to give yourself flavor. That's just chemicals in there. Mostly. There's no nutrition. That's amazing. Okay. So that's meat on the bone. Gotta do the organ Meats. Fermented in sprouted Foods. At least five times a week. You say that's yogurt. Obviously, that's from a, just you say, sprouted grains. We kind of talked about the Ezekiel bread that would, that would be in there legumes. Sprouted nuts and seeds and then fresh on cooked ingredients, so just everybody's inflamed.
I mean everybody's inflamed maybe you two aren't but like I don't know a woman who at night when she's putting on her nightgown or pajamas. Isn't like why do I look 10 pounds heavier than I looked this morning when I got up, you know, and it's inflammation. And I don't know if if I eat if I do all these things that you're saying, am I not going to have that anymore? Or is that just being human 80 to 90% of the inflammation and inflammatory problems. People are suffering from is coming from these seed oils that were never in our Hood.
Bye. Until say we invented the factory processes for doing these. They were released into the food supply, without any studies showing that they were like safe. And the worst irony here. Is that the American Heart Association got money from a company, selling one of the seed oils. So they actually decided to declare it as heart healthy. So, that's why these things have gotten a pass for so long because and no one's really been talking about them or paying attention to them. Because we have been misled into believing that
Only are they not toxic? They're actually the thing to go for and that we've been misled into believing that these things are what we should eat instead of traditional fats like butter. And we've made lard a dirty word literally because of the American Heart Association and its relationship with these companies that gave them money to say, seed oils were healthy, but they should not have been released into the food supply without studies to first show that they were safe. And now what's happened is that we're all eating them.
Are eating, we're getting 80% of your fat calories from these seed oils. So it's like, we've been in a giant experiment without like our consent. Like nobody told us. We're in this experiment and the experiment is what happens when a few population seed oils. What happens is? You get inflamed and you don't feel like exercising, you overeat, you get fat, you get diabetic, and you develop all of these chronic diseases, 80 to 90% of the chronic diseases that I see every day. When I see patients are related to
Summation which comes primarily from all these seed oil. So it's really like when you get them out of your diet is really the gift that keeps on giving. Yeah, just reminding people that Kate is in addition to being a biochemist and the nutritionist, is also a doctor and practices Family Medicine. So she sees patients, and knows of what she speaks. Can, I spend a minute on collagen marks? I know this is something that you've spent some time on to, and I just liked the look of these collagen supplement. I saw this.
Little, in my husband, and I went and stayed at it, had sort of the old fashioned delivery, look on the, on the outside of the bottle. And then I never did anything with them. And we have an Advertiser that that sells collagen to and and I wonder because I've heard both things and like it's great is a game changer and I've heard no it's yet another sort of placebo effect kind of thing. What say you
Well when I say much like what Kate said, I've been referring to collagen is the fourth macronutrient for 10 years, you know, if we go back and look at that meat on the bone picture that that we all had basically in the last in the 50s and 60s. We grandma made chicken stock or she made she boiled beef. Stock made soups. My mother. Use knocks gelatin kids ate Jello. So we actually
Ali had some source of these gelatinous materials. These collagen peptides in our diet, and into the, even into the 80s and 90s and then 90s the early offs people stop eating jello because it was sugary and they stopped. I don't know. Anybody takes knocks gelatin for their skin hair and nails now and so and then we were eating the choice cuts of meat, right? Just the rib eye and just you know, just the quarter house in the new whatever we weren't, we weren't consuming those parts of the animal that we're providing. And by the way, we were
Chicken, without the skin and like skinless, boneless chicken breast, which was the bodybuilding, you know, go to 44, high-protein. So all of this cause I think a generation of people who had severe issues with cartilage with ligaments and tendons. So you get ACL tears. And in professional sports, you get all these issues because we weren't giving the body the raw material we needed to repair the actual the collagen parts of the body, you know, a college.
It's the predominance of the protein type in the human body and we weren't giving our bodies the raw material. So with that, in mind, I've been looking at collagen supplementation for the last 15 years. I mean, I fixed a severe Achilles tendon issue by supplementing with a lot of college in every day. So, I had a personal experience with this. So I think collagen is critical for for maintenance of the soft tissue connective tissue, the faccia, the ligaments, the tendons, the
Skin hair and nails. And so, I supplement, personally, I supplement with collagen because I'm also one who I'd like to eat nose to tail, which is how you can get halogen. But, you know, I'm averse to certain nether parts of that animal. Just like you might be and so, and I don't think I get enough of it through eating chicken skin or, you know, knowing on the bones the way I used to as a
kid. Wow, that's so fascinating. So does it matter the form of the supplement, you know, because you can take
A powder. You can like what, how do you do this a
lot? Sure. I mean there's a lot of different hair types of collagen type 1 type 2, type 3 there. And there, make sure someone's bovine, summons fish-based, some chicken based. And and as Kate said, you're you also want glycosaminoglycans and Glycine and things like that. So some of the supplements have have all of these in them, but they're basically collagen peptides there, there, there, there.
Amino, acids peptides and they're like two or three amino acids at a time bonded, together that can pass through the gut barrier, get in the bloodstream and go where they need to
go. All right. Your to, you're too polite to say it, but I think we can get it your website too. So tell us what that is is this is not you trying to advertise you were going to mention it. I'll mention it. That
if you want some weed Primal kitchen.com., We have college. We sell collagen peptides and varieties. We have coffee creamers and and just unflavored or flavor
reduce people's life easier. They
I've come to trust you. So it's like that, you know, there's a lot of showing kids out there. They never, they don't know. We let me pause you there because I want to get in a call or Pam and Texas has a collar as a question about MCT oil and I have the same question. Hi, Pam. What's your question? Hi. I saw a TED Talk. The lady whose husband had Alzheimer's was in the beginning stages of it, and had the scan done and it was just not good. And then she gave him MCT oil.
It was more than it says in the Bible and coconut oil. And then months months months later. They went back and did another scan? And it was so improved that her unofficial recommendation is that you should incorporate that into your diet. She also talked about the ketones in your brain. Why Alzheimer's happens with glucose and all that. So, I don't know is that is MCT oil, something that is helpful.
Well to incorporate God, Kate you're the doctor. You actually get the exact same benefits from incorporating, really? Any healthy fats at the end following an otherwise Healthy nutrition nutrient dense. Diet. In fact, you get more benefits MCT oil is just kind of high in a certain kind of a fatty acid that if your metabolically damaged, then you can. Sometimes some people can get a little more energy from that but it's nowhere near as effective as the whole program of just
Cutting out the nasty stuff, especially the seed, oils, the excess sugar and including all the healthy fats that you possibly can in your diet and also getting a good balance amount of protein. So, yeah, people will love to sell you, supplements of all kinds of things just because there's such a high profit margin there, but you really want to be careful of the collagen supplement is one of the few actual supplements that I do recommend myself. And in fact, I consult for a company myself, that sells collagen supplements, but that's it, in terms of, for me for supplements then the
East of your supplements should be vitamins and minerals because most of it is total height because most people would rather just say here, take this supplement, then go through the whole Spiel. I love. What is the actual healthy diet? What are the hateful eight? How much sugar should you have in all this sort of thing? And, you know, you do if you just get even just a tiny benefit from a supplement that gives you a lot of hope. So maybe that is a good thing. It's a fast way to get yourself motivated, but that's just the first of many steps that you can take in order to improve the health.
Of somebody who is starting with early Alzheimer's or has any kind of a, any kind of a cognitive problem actually because they're all related to inflammation. Okay, you touched on something about you know people like doing these supplements. I was surprised to see one of your other recommendations is do not buy protein powders. It's like my entire morning smoothie that I make for my children is falling apart. We put MCT oil in there and we put protein powders in there. Now, we do put spinach in there and a bunch of
Of berries and some yogurt. So I'm with you. I think I felt like I felt like a good mother until we got to this last part. Well, we know there's this term that's come out in the past few years that I love. It's called ultra-processed foods and it's they're starting to talk about how. Okay? So we don't need to worry about cholesterol. We need to worry about how the food is processed. And the ultra processing is the worst, and there are three major types of ultra-processed ingredients fat which of the seed oils.
18, which is mostly protein, powders and carbs, which is refined flours and sugars. Those are ultra-processed ingredients that make up ultra-processed foods that everyone is now on board. With the idea that these things are, what's killing us, and making us fat and making us metabolically unhealthy. So yeah, so a protein powders are just there. Ultra-processed. The most of the nutrition is removed. We were never meant to have our protein predigested for us. It's basically predigested. So it will bump up.
Up your tit, your blood sugar blood, not your sugar. But your amino acid level in your blood, which has the same kind of detrimental effects as too much sugar in the bloodstream. So protein powder is actually different from collagen powder because the way it's made and processed in the way your body processes, it there's dramatic differences. So that's why I that's why I still can recommend collagen powder. Although I would much rather you make your own bone broth, and I put next movie.
These are got yogurt. So I don't need to add protein. All right, I like this call. This is William from South Carolina, Mark. And he's got a question like a lot of the people who listen to this show live when it's on Sirius XM. He's a trucker. And so, you know, he hears Us in the in his truck and he's got a question about about that high. William. What's your question? Yes, take my call. I just had I travel a lot. I go from South Carolina to California back as an Open Road Trucker, and I just want to see if there's any suggestions on trying to eat better and be a little bit.
Healthier out on the road and put it's very tough, you know, all the ingredients that she, you know, you just can't can't make that in the truck if there's any suggestions. It's a very good question, Williams, not having luck finding Ezekiel bread at the Motel 6 Diner. Mark. What are we going to do for him? I
mean, that's, that's a really tough one. I mean, I would say that access to healthy food as is a real issue for a lot of people and especially truckers, and I don't think the pilot, you know,
This, the stops that you make are going to be providing a lot of this. So, I think there's some work involved. I think it's going to, it's going to be planning, meals in advance and a lot of Tupperware. I mean, I hate to put it like that but alternatively, if you can find a steakhouse on the road and just go get a steak and a grilled vegetable and be done with it. And not, you know, and forgo the roles the basket of rolls for go. The baked potato and and kind of fill in the gaps. There is
If you are at a restaurant with a decent piece of meat and a decent vegetable, you can cover a lot of ground at and then the other thing I say, with truckers is whatever you can get out and walk do it.
Yeah. Well that's important and we're going to we're going to talk about exercise, and we're going to talk about the weight loss drug. Sweeping these sort of Rich circles that I've got a toe in. And I want to know more about this diabetes drug. They're saying is going to be some sort of a cure-all, is it?
Is it Kate Mark have answers right after this break?
Okay, before I forget can you guys help me understand how this applies to Children? I've referenced my kids. My assistant. Abby's worried about her kids. All my staff has kids like does do all these same rules. Apply to how we feed. Our kids Kate, nature likes to make it simple. So, yes, what's good for you at one stage of life is good for you at every stage of life. And yeah, it's in fact the earlier you start with.
Kids. The more benefits they get because it can potentially change things like how tall they will get how strong and robust their joints are whether or not they're going to go through puberty like on time or even completely go through puberty. There's a huge huge impact on the child's health. And so like it's really the more important the earlier that you start and it does get easier. It just has to you know, you
Have to believe it yourself, you can lead by example. And then you know, when children are given Foods actual really healthy foods that taste, you know, interesting or new. And you seem to like them in a positive kind of, you know, imagine the Italian family around the table. Like, you know, try this. I worked all day making, it, that kind of a thing. That's, that's one way that makes introducing new foods and healthy. Let me ask you a follow-up. I find breakfast is the highwomen
Artist me how to get your kids to eat healthy at like my kids. Well, they'll have eggs. They like eggs two out of three like yogurt and even plain yogurt. As long as you put enough berries in there, they'll eat it and then we run out of really healthy options. You know, I don't I haven't they're not much into the Ezekiel bread. Like if I made him, do it with peanut butter, they might do it. But like to have any good breakfast suggestions for kids that are healthy. Well, there's like 87, different salads thousand different things you can do with eggs.
And one of the things that kids might really love is make crepes. So crepes are a lot like pancakes, except they're mostly egg and just a little bit of flour to hold it together, but then you can put like a whipped cream in there with just a little bit of vanilla and a teeny bit of sweetener and you're giving them plenty of healthy fats, you're giving the protein and nutrients from the egg, and it's something like familiar and can play with that. And then there's all kinds of like paleo versions of Pancakes to, and, and then there's like muffins that are made.
More protein, Rich kinds of starchy elements. A you make muffins. That means you can make one of those things called Savory custards, right? You make custard custard. Is a really, you know, it's like pudding, basically. And a lot of kids, what you can make a sweet custard for a kid, or you can make a Savory one if for a more sophisticated palate, so there's 1,001 things you can do with eggs and then there's a lot you can do with a dairy to like you already started there with
Putting yogurt a putting a little fruit on it, but you can bump up the like the pleasure of it with you can actually top yogurt with whipped cream. Why not just put a very lightly lightly sweetened like a tiny little bit of sugar or sweetener in the whipped cream and a little bit of vanilla because vanilla magnifies, the natural sweetness that's already in there. And actually, I did that for the Lakers we had that of their
Faye, and it was just it was a huge hit and then put other little things that, you know, kids, like as out for them to top it, with sort of like a sundae bar. Except but with yogurt, or if they don't like yogurt cottage cheese, or if regular yogurt, is too sour, then use Greek yogurt. Also, in your book. Is this in that the fat burn fix? Yes. Okay. Got more ideas like that. There is good because people are gonna want to know. It's good to know, Mark. Let's talk exercise because we gotta do it. You gotta do it.
And I like the way you approach it. You say look forget everything. There are four essential movements you need to do there just for do these four and you're going to be in relatively decent shape. What are the four?
So let's take a step back. This is in the absence of a gym or in the absence of a trainer, or the absence of access to weights. You can get a tremendous work out doing push-ups, pull-ups planks.
And air squats. The planks are just you know that you're on your elbow is on the ground with your body out straight. And and so that's that's sort of like my vacation. There's no there's no gym in the hotel routine. Right? And I can get a tremendous work out doing it. But what I would say is with regard to exercise, look, all of the weight loss gains are going to come from. How you orchestrate your eating strategy, your diet.
Yeah, a lot of
She's not that lot of questions asking, what's the percentage food versus
exercise? You cannot? You cannot exercise way of add diet and sort of a mantra now, but also people, shouldn't for instance, count the calories that they burn in a workout. And these wearable devices that will tell you. Oh, I played tennis and they burn 1200 calories is BS. It's, there's no way that that's even an issue and the fact that you did burn some calories in many. It may many cases. If your diet is not right. You might go home and over.
Each you might have body. Might you pray my have you over. Consume carbohydrates, for instance to make up for all the glycogen you burn, because you weren't that good at burning fat. So if you train your eye to become a good, a good burning fat, that kind of goes away, but the strategy really is is it's about movement. What we, what we want to do is we want to lose fat from the way we eat, and then we want to tone and we want to create, you know, range of Mobility from our choices of exercise. So, for that reason, I say,
Everyone like walking is still the greatest thing ever invented for humans, but for bipedal, we're supposed to walk, we're designed to walk so we should walk as often as we as we can. You want a jog that's fine. You want to ride along but as much as you can, I mean you can walk a minimum of 45 minutes three times a week would be great start and then if you want to supplement that with getting on an exercise bike or bike outside or slimming, all these low-level aerobic activities are designed to keep your body moving to
They're designed to make the the fat metabolism improved by the throughput of these fat substrates so that you do that you burn that instead of the glycogen or instead of a carbohydrate and then twice a week, do some kind of weight training. That's the four essential movements that I just talked about or it's going to the gym and throwing some weights around in the gym now and then and then once a week, I tell people you got to do something really all out. You got to Sprint and they couldn't, it doesn't have to be sprinting like running from something, but it could be
20 seconds of all-out effort on a bike swimming on a StairMaster. On an elliptical whatever whatever you want to do. Do it, 20 seconds hard. Wait 2 minutes, 20 seconds, hard way to minutes and do that a couple of times because the body really is designed to like be in that sort of a fight or flight mode once in a while.
Oh, that's fascinating. Okay, because I do have a note. What does sprinting mean? I got like I didn't understand so you're saying at least once a week because the way you you're short forms on these three,
Main components of the Primal blueprint for fitness program lift, heavy things, three, two to three times a week, run really fast, one time per week, move frequently to slow pace three to five hours per week. So the run really fast. You have sprinting but doesn't have to be spending. You're saying, basically kind of interval training or I guess we'll go hard for 20 seconds, rest for 2 minutes, 20 seconds for a total of 15 20
minutes, that's it and and it's not doesn't sound like that much. But if you do it, right, you're pretty gassed at the end of that. And, and again, a lot of people who don't have
You know, their knees are kind of broken down over the years or can't Sprint like, run sprints, you know, you can do it on the bike as I say, you can do it on an elliptical trainer. You can do it on air and then airdyne you can do it full, you know, there's lots of in a pool for sure.
Yeah, that's very easy on your body. I like that a lot and the walking so I see up my cardiologist once a year because my dad died of a sudden heart attack at age 45, so I'm very conscious of my health, heart health, and thank God. I'm in good shape, but I go once a year and I have a stress test and
It's, you know, they put you on the machine and you run and then they you have to lie down right at the end and they hook you up and they check all that. The cardiologist said walk walk, walk walk walk. Please tell me about somebody who was 65 years old, who came in and her heart capacity was basically that of somebody half her age, and he said, what's the deal? And she said, I don't lift weights. I don't do anything, but everyday, I walk around the reservoir in New York City, you know, the Jack Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis Reservoir, and it probably take you about
35, 30 minutes to walk around the reservoir, not to mention what it takes to get there and get back home. And she said that's all I've been doing since I was 25 years old. So for 40 years, that's what she's been doing. And she said she was off the charts in terms of her lung capacity, in our heart health, and all that. So good to know like good old walking as you point out. We were meant to do it. Do
it. Yeah.
Doesn't take one point. I think the key point and what he said to you. Your cardiologist said to you, is that the best exercise is exercise that you enjoy because the, you can know all
Oh, all the things in the world that exercise but if you don't do it, they're not going to help you. And there's really no wrong kind of exercise because your body benefits from every kind of exercise that there is out there. We just used to call everything that you described Mark. The term prize sounds familiar cross-training like we used to just say yeah, do if you are a runner make sure to do some lifting, maybe do some biking or swimming or something else or actually play a sport. Most team sports are actually a great like super super form of exercise dad.
Saying is also an amazing form of exercise. And one of the things I want to just point out, is that when we're talking about diet and exercise, we talk about them like they're separately, but they really shouldn't do that because diet supplies, the raw materials to do what exercise, just told your body that you need to do more of to build like the parts to do all of that. And so when you're walking you're doing some cardio, you're helping keep your
Vascular. But system, building new blood vessels, keeping your heart healthy. When you're running, you're doing that times 10. When you're lifting heavy, things you're building muscle. You're making your bones stronger and more robust. So, the two things are they go? Hand-in-hand. And that's why we always talk about them together, but they, they really liked the role of exercise is not so much weight loss. It's about building healthy tissues and being healthy and being able to just enjoy life. So exercise should always be fun. One of the things not on your list. Mark is cardio. Bunny.
You know, is do an hour of aerobics a
day in at that. So if that's your your thing, go for it. I'm I don't know much about cardio bunny. I gotten away from the more popular, you know, exercise du jour, kind of, kind of things. Look, as Kate said, any kind of exercise that you enjoy? And I came, I came. I was a trainer in the 80s, when, when, you know, the aerobics movement became the big thing in Jane Fonda, basically, transformed now,
Not just Jane Fonda, Mark. Some of us are out there
doing our part in Upstate New York as well.
Kathy Smith, a good friend of mine. She was there too. But you know, it's, but it's, but that was amazing and it changed a lot of lives, right? But then there's, there's the possibility that you can overdo that sort of thing. Which brings us back to why Walking is Still the best kind of thing that you can do with regularity for the rest of your life. And I think that that's exciting because it's not as daunting to think, well Jesus,
It's
longevity is what I'm after and mobility and all I have to do is walk or you kidding me. I don't have to go struggle and suffer and sweat, and sacrifice and strain and get injured and all these other things.
Yeah, to quote that, you know, should have been Oscar winner. Santa Claus is coming to town, just put one foot in front of the other. Okay. Sorry, let's talk about, I got you. Everyone say, forget all that. I'm not doing it. Better Living Through modern.
Medicine, what are the options? Because I will tell you here in Connecticut, where I am my friend, my hair stylist has told me this that half of the women are on some diabetes drug that is supposed to be, you know, the new Elixir when it comes to losing weight. It's, of course, very expensive. That's why I say it's like when is well off circles, but dr. Kate, what is it? And is it legit? Like, it? Should we be trying to pursue trying to find the name of it?
Here we go. V metformin. That's all I have written down. That format has been with us for a long time. It's a diabetes drug that we use to help poison the liver, so it doesn't produce so much sugar. So it will lower your blood sugar. And then, the newer drugs are come from actually a lizard poison called, The Gila monster. And it says, there in this category called glp-1, and their names are like trulicity byetta owes them pick at their most of them are in jail.
Isabel. You're going to have to give yourself a little subcutaneous shot, once once a week or sometimes, once a day and they do help to lower your fasting blood sugar. Now. Does that translate to weight loss? Not very much if any like the studies actually show that you do lose some weight. You do lose. Maybe the average person lost in a, in a study, where they take the maximum dose of the newest one, which is this. The Gila monster type.
Maybe they would lose about 2 pounds in a year. Maybe three some people gain weight. So it's not a year. Yeah, it's not really the answer. No, it's not the answer. That's disappointing. Okay, so that's not as exciting as I thought. What about? Okay. This is actually one of our listeners called, in Janelle from Texas. Has got an interesting question that we've also been buzzing about on the team. Hi, Janelle. What's your question? - about the fennel seed? I was told that panel.
See, it's good for anti-inflammatory. I have a lot of problems with my knees. Mama diabetic. All right, true. Or false, fennel seed.
Fennel seed in the diet is good. In terms of there's some nutrition in it because it's a spice in terms of does it have special anti-inflammatory properties? No, most of the inflammation that causes arthritis is driven by everything. We've been talking about in this show, like the seed oils out of toxins, the empty calories, and the lack of nutrition. So that's really the fundamental basis for treating any kind of
Inflammatory problem. But well, is it it, what's easier? Taking this supplement? Which I happen to sell off my website or explaining everything. Right? So 9 times out of 10, the answer for some kind of anti-inflammatory supplement is going to be, it's just eat the food. If you like funnel, you're going to get more benefits from that. Then you will from some pill that claims to have fennel in it, which probably has some fennel at the max right? Me. It could be anything. Okay, Ma be anti cancel, the fennel order.
A lot Canadian. Debbie. You got us all excited about this yesterday. Okay, let's go to and she's also in Connecticut. She's got a question that I think will be good for you, Mark. What's your question? And hi. Hi. It's actually first, a comment more of a comment. 2018. I picked up marks book, the keto reset diet because I always am looking for ways to feel better. Have more energy. You know, I'm 57 and right around 50. I thought, you know, I
Could put a little more effort into it and it was hugely intimidating. But I just knew there was something to it and I kind of want to say to the audience listening. It's really hard to get started, eating healthier, but it is so much better. And once you know this stuff, you can't unknow it. So you go through the supermarket and you start reading labels and you just put it back and say I know this is bad for me. Why am I going to put it in my cart and pay for it?
So, I want to thank Mark for his book. I mean, we might drag my husband along and we did keto for over a year, and then it got really boring to go out to dinner with friends. So we sort of left being so strict because it is really hard. But the way I eat now is so much better and it's, it's just a habit. It's not saying I don't fall off the wagon, but it is so worth it to just take control of what you're putting in your body and you feel better. All right, and I got to wrap you.
Because we got it. We only have a short time left. Mark your thoughts on keto to close it out because it's very popular. But there is a question about whether it's sustainable.
No, so Anne, had a head, like, the ideal consummate experience, which was it worked for her and then it got boring for the book that she's talking about is called the keto reset diet. It's about using sceeto Aikido strategy to reset your metabolism to develop this metabolic flexibility. And now she's at a point where she doesn't need to eat cookie dough, but you need, she knows what to eat. She knows how to read labels. She
Good news. Is she knows what to do. The bad news? Is she falls off the wagon? She knows what to do. So right right. Okay. Let me ask a
quick follow-up question, though. I'm on the meds. Is there a supplement? So not fennel seeds and maybe not those other things that I be these things. But is there a supplement that helps with appetite control anything like that? Or is it just back to see the beginning of our discussion about eating better to curb hunger?
You got to do the work and you there's no
But you can't hack your way around this, really? It's like there are no pills that work. There are lots of pills or no pills at work. You have to do the work but the good news is the work is easy. If you understand it and Kate's book, my book once, um, and what and commented about, once you understand what's going on, then, you know what to do. I want everybody to become an intuitive eater. I don't want anyone to say, what would Mark do? Or what would take say? I want you to become an intuitive eater. As a result of this metabolic
flexibility. All right, last question. What should I give up?
June, 12th, I'm going to ask you both that, Kate. I'll start with you. What should I give up for this? Adjust to try for a year starting, June 12th, seed oils. And if you don't know where to start with that, then the most fattening food. As according to Harvard is french fries. They are saturated with seed oils and worst. Yes. Yes, good guess. Okay. So that was the worst and then, okay, Mark and what do you think I should give up because my audience may come along with me for this ride.
Well, I mean, I would say, I would have said seed oils from
In the beginning of this whole conversation and and I would say that. So the biggest issue is going to be when you dine out like every great restaurant which has break got to meet great produce. They destroy it with soybean oil and all kinds of other stuff. They put in the sauces and dressings. So that's really where I watch out for everything. What do you do about? You asked him Kitt. Can you cook it in butter? If it's a salad? Can you just do Brett, some oil and vinegar and some olive oil and vinegar, you know, there's some ways around that but you got to be really careful because rest.
Answer pretty Insidious for a lot of people. Trying to avoid seed oils. Okay, and then didn't desserts. I mean, you got this thing about your kid is having ice cream. I don't want to criticize your parenting but as I know but at some point I think if you could replace some of those with with sweet healthier choices, and then you make those choices yourself and your husband as well, and set, by example, sort of reduce the amount of desert in your life. That would be the big thing for me like, dessert twice a week. Not more than that.
Yeah. Oh, I love it. You guys, you are awesome. We have to do this more often. I've, I was like, how are we going to fill two hours now? I'm like, we need two more, this wasn't enough time. Thank you. Both so much. Katie, Mark, all the Best, Buy their books support them. They're trying to help us all and we greatly appreciate it. Thanks for joining us today. And all week. We are lining up some great shows for your next week, including one with Dinesh, D'Souza by popular demand. He has a new documentary out called 2000 mules. That's
A
ton of attention. So you requested him will provide him. Download the Megyn Kelly show on Apple Pandora Spotify and Stitcher in the meantime, so you don't miss it. Also at youtube.com slash Megyn Kelly and stay tuned because next week could be the week. We find the Supreme Court liquor. Thanks for listening. Have a great weekend.
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