Hello, ladies and germs boys and girls lemurs and squirrels all things under the sun and this is Tim Ferriss. Welcome to another episode of the Tim Ferriss show where it is my job to deconstruct world-class performers people who are excellent world class at what they do to tease out all sorts of things Frameworks questions. They ask favorite books influences. You name it Lessons Learned my guest. Today is Texas native Matthew McConaughey. He is one of Hollywood's most sought-after Leading Men a chance meeting in Austin long.
go with casting director and producer Don Phillips led him to director Richard linklater who launched the actor's career in the cult classic Dazed and Confused since then, he has won an Academy Award for his portrayal of Ron Woodroof in Dallas Buyers Club appeared in more than 40 feature films that have grossed more than 1 billion dollars and has become a producer director and philanthropist with his just keep live and Foundation all the while sticking to his Texas roots and JK live in philosophy McConaughey also serves as
If director for wild turkey and has co-created his own bourbon Long Branch, he serves as minister of culture Moc for the University of Texas atletic Department and the Austin FC Soccer Club where he is part owner McConaughey will launch his first book green lights on October 20th, 2020 currently resides in Austin, Texas with his wife Camilla and their three kids while he is a professor at the University of Texas in Austin. You can find them on Facebook Matthew McConaughey on Instagram, officially.
McConaughey and on Twitter at McConaughey the books official website is green lights.com. Please enjoy this wide-ranging extremely enjoyable and entertaining conversation with none other than Matthew McConaughey.
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I'm a cybernetic organism living tissue over metal endoskeleton.
Matthew welcome to the
show Good to be here Tim. How are you
sir? I'm doing very well and I have just an embarrassment of riches in front of me in terms of notes that I would love to to take some stab at covering even a portion of and I thought we could begin with a little back story for those people who know your work but perhaps not your personal story. Let's paint a picture of your parents now I was in preparation for this conversation doing some homework.
I came across a quote of yours. Feel free to fact-check this of course, this is from the guardian but it says one of the great images I have of my father is on the phone with the cigarette at the airport on the pay phone always peddling. We what was he peddlin pipe and how pipe what is what is that for those who don't know
I've been coupling. So hearing the old business and to drill you obviously pipe and the couplings are what connect the pipe to drill for oil so dad was in the pipe and coupling business and he was he would call it peddling pipe.
Hadlen, pipe no ji-yong pedalling pedalling pipe and that's what he did on the phone 826 and then he hit the road and go make personal appearances trying to sell pipe. He started off as a truck driver then owned a Texaco station down Uvalde. We moved to Longview Texas in the oil boom and within like six months after being a Long View dad had like twenty six employees under him. That's how big of an oil boom it was and then obviously that that business fell through I think around 82
And he kind of held on from there. He was always a
pebble always
Peddler Islam was great. He was always because he never did it never went bankrupt and that was a piece of Honor for him not to go bankrupt, but he was always after the old boom sort of
busted. He was always like boys if I could just hit a lick I
fuck just hit a lick and he never did hit that lick. But if he
is a lick is that it was a
big sale a lick is a big account a lick is okay. Mr. Jimmy.
Donna hey, I want all my pipe from you and we're gonna drill two hundred thousand feet above eyes. So it's a huge account. Oh my gosh. I'm going to supply all the pipe to this one large account. That would be a lick. He never quite hit it.
So we're going to jump to the other track with Mom for a second here, and I'd like to have conversation about or description. Maybe a mink oil. I would like to
did you have to tell us
how many coil entered your life, please?
Yeah, I would not be here talking to you right now if it wasn't for the oil of Meek. Yeah, I think it was about homes. I 14 15 years old
ninth grade adolescence.
My mom starts paddling again peddling my whole while family was peddling something my mom starts peddling. This oil of me Product door-to-door sales. Look here. You put this mink oil on your face and it brings out all the impurities that you have and once those impurities
Are these all come out you then have clear glowing skin for the rest of your life. That was sort of the sales pitch. Right? Well, I'm 15. I got a few pimples as any 15 year-old does and one night. My mom goes. Well, you should choose this all of me. I'm like great GW. Let me do
that. Sure. So I start putting this oil and makeup on my face every night before I go to bed
and after about a week I wake up and I'm got more pimples than I had a week
before
and I check in the mirror and go to Mom has its own.
You guys got out yet exactly what it's supposed to do pull out all the impurities. Keep doing it stick with it Sherm as I just religiously keep putting it on. Well after two weeks now they seem to be running to a problem here. I've got I've got a whole face full of pimples and it's getting pretty severe I go back to my she's like, oh, wow. Well, you just got more impurities then I thought you'd have just keep doing it. I'm going to keep bringing out those impurities. I keep it up three weeks go by and now I've got full-blown acne and
and I'm really concerned a my mom's just staying on with it going. Wow, no stick with it all the impurities coming out. Well, I sneak off to a dermatologist on my own and my this was not my mom's recommendation. I sneak out there on my own this and I take a ball of this Miko with me and I go I got doc can lick my face is when you put on your face. I show them this bodies literally reads the ladies like oh no no, no, no, no. No, this is for someone that's like 40 year old or not a teenage child who's got oily pores anyone this
Locking your pores your pores. Can't breathe. You are 10 days away from having ice pick holes in your face from acne. We've got to get you off of this. Okay? Because we also have to get you on this stuff called Accutane. It's a Year's worth of medicine. It will dry you up there will have its complications, but it'll be better than the acting that you can have some boom. I get on the Accutane off the oil of Meek and around that time my dad who was always as I said peddlin and looking
How to hit a lick look Sam you guys damn boy? I think we got a lawsuit against this coming damn walloping company. I mean, you're you're good-looking son. Let me look at you. You're all swole up. So he takes me to see his lawyer and members lawyers name of Cheri hairs. So I'm sitting down with my dad and his lawyer. Jerry Harrison think we got a case and he asked me like, you know, I would did your confidence lower we know with these but these pimples you got this acting down by quoting. Yes, sir.
Doing
is good with the girls. And I said no sir. Not at all. He his eyes light up and I can tell that even at my age of 15 that he's building his case. He goes emotional distress. You were under emotions. You are under emotional distress and I look at him and I'm like sure yeah emotional distress and Jerry's slap gosh dog, we can get thirty five to fifty thousand dollars off this emotional distress go a long way Jim. My dad's like hot damn that tit. That's right. $50,000 its way to go.
Oh son, and so that's getting all excited about this deal. We're going to make $50,000 off of my emotional distress his youngest son. So anyway, meanwhile I'm on Accutane thing takes a year to get clear up and you get scaly your dandruff in your knees hurt you get slits in your mouth and everything else but much better than this acne. And this jacket thing starts clearing this acne up on my favorite. Well as lawsuits go, you know, they drag on a while. So come two years later. I'm
Back in Jerry Harrison Law Office sitting across the table from the from the defense attorney and now my acne cleared up. Okay, and this lawyer says there and starts off the conversation with me and goes. Oh my gosh, that must have been so emotionally distressful and I'm like, he's loving you softball here. I'm going to knock this out of the park. Yes, sir. It was highly emotional distressful and he's like I bet you confidence was down.
Down I was like he did it again. What's this guy doing? He's a horrible lawyer. He's teeing me up or just knock it out of the park and getting some yes. It was so mostly distressful. My confidence was low wasn't doing well with the girls. I mean mean it was bad stuff sir, and I'm sitting here thinking we got this case. Well this don't go so boy gets his Cheshire a big grin on his face reaches under the desk and pulls out this green yearbook, and it's got a page marked on it. And is it over in front of me turns around and
Opened it to a specific that specific earmark page and points to a picture.
Now this was the 1988 yearbook for Long View High School, which now, I was a senior and mind you this lawsuit started back when I was a sophomore in this picture my senior year he points to and said who's that and there's a picture of camisa Springs really beautiful lady girl eight-year-old with a sash across her chest says most beautiful well arm and arm with her and next to her.
Is he on named Matthew McConaughey with the sash his chest? It says most handsome Isis that see that I squint my eyes on like, oh, we just lost the case. I look about him the boys smiles and he goes so emotionally distressful in right then we had lost the case and it was over and I remember my dad him and hauled for four months gosh. Damn it boy.
We were going to win $50,000 and you gotta go off a win most handsome. You're screwed up the whole deal man oil of mink and the McConaughey's who chase litigations but never quite went them. That was another way of my dad trying to hit a lick and I screwed it up by winning most handsome.
Was it true in your family? I read this of course can't believe everything that you read two things. Number one that your parents were divorced twice married three times, so they ended up getting up one more time.
Got knocked down true. Number two that saying I can't was forbidden or highly advised against very how
heavily heavily heavily. I remember cuss word. You could say shit and talk and damn and even occasionally maybe get away with the lord's name in vain, but never you weren't really that was on the line, but the real words that we got like
either punished for war forbidden were hate and can't and I remember my dad. I remember one Saturday morning when I was about 12 my Saturday morning chores were do you know mow the lawn? We teed shine his shoes and sweep the porches and get the cobwebs out of Corners. Well, I'd get up very early on a Saturday morning to do that. So I could have my Saturday afternoon to play and I went out to try and start our push lawnmower and it wouldn't
start pull again wouldn't start pull again. We'll just start check the
Actually, it's got gas what the heck's going on. Damn. It won't start. I
remember going into my dad inside and go Dad the can't get the lawnmower started and he comes slowly turned his head to me and I saw his molars meet and kind of talk to grit his teeth. He goes you what and I knew and not right then to not say the word again, and I said II and he got up and I didn't finish my sentence. He slowly walked with me out of his
Bedroom through the kitchen through the garage around the back to the shed where this lawnmower was that I was not getting started. He without saying a word he knelt down looked at it check the gas better than anyone. He found
the little tube there the gas was not transferring and had been disconnected. So they
so he reconnected that pulled a few times and it started and there over a run new now running push lawnmower. He looked at me put his hands on my shoulders from for the first time since I said,
Can't get it started he put his hands on my shoulders look to me and very sternly
said he goes you see something
you were just having trouble from his lawnmower and boom, you know, and I remember from that day as that lesson was like, oh even if you're unable to do something on your own you can still go seek help or we get assistant. So you're still only having trouble even if you own your own cannot do so that was a say in those words still to this day if I let him
Slip I kind of have to look over my shoulder like oh, yeah, I can get me
so there are many different forms of influences. I'd like to ask you about one that is not your parents. Not your siblings. It's a book that I've read. You came across ahead and impact in your life. And that is the greatest salesman in the world by Og mandino. Could you explain for people listening why that book was impactful?
What impact it had? Yeah.
Yeah, so I'm never been a big reader and growing up didn't read much and never really liked even his school being told. Hey, you got to read this book. You got to read this just the fact of being told I had to read something in school or by someone else sort of made me feel like it wasn't mine and I was not going to have a subjective view of it and plus it just don't like being told what to do, but this came to me this book and I always say this I didn't find it it found me and I'll tell you how and why
Why it was between my sophomore and junior year in college at University of Texas at Austin. Now at this point I was always on the track to become a lawyer. I was going to become that defense attorney. I was going to become better that's defense attorney. If you don't get us some oil and make money. Yeah, I mean get the families from all of make money. I was a good behavior. I took good stance has it started off in the family. They're like cheese. Oh man, you know, I would take the table and win arguments with the family and neglecting God. Damn. You got to become a
You have become the family lawyer. So that was always the plan. Well between my sophomore and junior year in college, which is about the time when all those General liberal arts credits that you're getting need to have started having some Focus or you're going to lose them. Right? So I'm start not sleeping well with the idea of becoming a lawyer but I'm doing the math. I'm like, I'm not sure it's what I want to do. I got here I go to law school didn't get out and I'm start maybe get an intern. I'm really not going to be rolling in my vocation.
Tell them my 30s and I was like do I want I don't really want to spend my 20s just learning or some my 20s just in school. Now. I had been riding a lot been keeping a lot of short stories in my Diaries and a lot of them which are in this in this book green lights, but I didn't have the confidence to think that maybe I wanted to get the storytelling business until a good friend of mine. Rob bindler who I think with the time was NYU film school who had been sharing some of these short stories with you know, one of the fun goes. Hey, you should think about
You know getting in front or behind the camera, you know, you tell great stories. You got good character yourself, you know, you're a good writer to try this out and I was always like oh no, I mean that's that's like to avant-garde to Europeans to The Artsy that can't do that. But he gave me the confidence to really considerate now, I go to my fraternity house the Dell house into that sophomore year for sophomore exams. I'm a studier. All right.
Right. I'm making I got a 3.8 to GPA. I'm II I like making my A's and any amount of time. I've got to study I will use it every single minute. There's never enough time for me to study I go to the jailhouse and right behind it in a little Bungalow is one of my belt brothers and I eat lunch and I sit on his couch and I've got three hours before my exam and I open up my book study for my psychology exam for whatever reason for the first time in my life. I
Shot him and I go McConaughey to myself I go you got this. You don't need to study more first time. I've done that. I got three hours to go. I've been put on the TV. I love sports ESPN. I'll watch cricket the strongest man competition. I'll watch you know, two grasshoppers race for whatever reason. I just I'm not interested. I turn on the TV.
I look over to my left. There's a stack of magazines. There's Sports illustrated's and Playboy's and I'm like, geez. I like sports like checking out naked ladies in the Playboy. Let's check that out. I pick up a Playboy flip through thumb through that half Ashley and all of a sudden lose interest in that.
Okay. What am I supposed to do here? Got two and a half at three hours to kill. Well, I start peeling back those magazines Playboy's and Sports Illustrated and everything else and about seven deep in that stack of magazines to the left of the couch where I was sitting I see this white paper back with this beautiful read cursive writing on it and it says the greatest salesman in the world.
And I remember reaching for it and allowed to myself saying who is that and I pick up the book and I start reading it again. I'm not I'm not a reader but I start reading this book and all of a sudden I lose track of time and I've gotten past the whole prologue to the beginning of this first scroll in this book, which is I will form good habit to become their slave. Now what this book had just told me and just taking me on a journey and said you will read each
There's 10 Scrolls inspect each scroll three times a day for 30 days until you move on to the next scroll. So it's basically a 10-month read and I had gotten to the first scroll and had been now understood I now understood that the greatest salesman in the world.
Was whoever's going to read so I was like, oh, that's me talking to me. Well bam, I look up. Oh my exams and 50 minutes. I gotta go right ahead. I'll go to my exam I Psychology exam. I ripped through that exam. I didn't care if I failed it. I something this book had told me know this book is what you need to be in to right. Now. This book is going to give you confidence to go do what you need to do. I ripped through that psychology exam and immediately go. I'm going to film school. I'm calling Dad night. I'm not going to go to law school.
So many more I've got the confidence this book found me. This is a seminal moment in my life. I don't know how or why but it is and I'm going to get the courage to call my dad and go.
And that night I remember thinking about it McCall my that at 7:30 Hill sat down maybe at his first cocktail already had dinner and he'll be in a good mood for me to say, you know, Dad. I want to go to film school. I think well, I call him 736 p.m. Hey Dad. Hey, what's up? So, uh, listen, I don't really know I was nervous and I said, I don't think I want to go to law school anymore. I want to go to film school that was hard for me to say because I thought he was going to go you want to do what boy but the help
Up until now. Hold on good film school. He was a long pause on the phone about 5 seconds. And he says
you sure that's what you want to do
son. I said, yes, sir.
There's another five second pause then he said.
Three of the greatest words I've ever been told don't
half-ass it.
I remember going on don't have facet and I remember my eyes just lit up and I was like, oh my gosh one my dad not only approved. He gave me a responsibility. He gave me Freedom he gave me more than a privilege. He like sent me a flight and ending it with like not only do I agree and say that's okay son. I'm saying if you're gonna do it, you better damn we'll go do it well and don't half-ass it and I went down the next day changed. My course schedule did my GPA got me into film school. Is that a 3.8?
I didn't have any sort of art to show them and I started off behind the camera and then ended up as I am now in front of the camera as well, but that book that day that book Finding Me and me feel like it was my secret and it came to me and no one told me here. You need to read this book. It'll be good for you. Hey, you supposed to read this. This is your for school or even a recommendation. It was not wreck it found me. And I read that book every that did exactly what it said.
Good morning, noon and night and I read I've read it three times now that way but the first time I didn't miss one reading of that I mean and I had many a day where I went out in the morning on a Saturday in my day of Whimsy took me to a place where all of a sudden it was 10 o'clock at night and I was like an hour and a half from my house and the book was back at my house.
And I'd be like hanging out partying and going like oh geez and I would stop eat something get some coffee drink a bunch of water wait till whatever 1:30 in the morning when I was time to drive and I would drive back to my place grab that book and either read it and go to sleep in my bed or drive back to where I was hanging out with the book and read it. I didn't miss one single Reed for 10 straight months and that book is the most instrumental piece of literature.
ER and motivation I've ever read for me in
my life. And now you've produced green lights this book which as you've described it is not a traditional Memoir or an advice book, but rather a Playbook based on adventures in my life, and I want to hop to a particular portion of this book, which is also a scrapbook of sorts. It's very multimedia in that respect even though it's in 2D and book
format. I want to ask you about a note
and
We'll segue into the practice of writing since you've kept a diary for somewhere between 35 40 years at this point. I believe there's a note towards the end of green lights from nine 192. Yeah. So 10 goals in life this blew my
mind mine.
So I want to read these 10 and then I want you to kind of place us in your life when you wrote These 10, and then I want to zoom in on a few of them, but let me just read these.
Ten first attend goals in life. This is a 1992 one become a
father to find and keep the
woman from III. Keep my relationship with God for Chase. My best self Five be an egotistical utilitarian. That's going to be my first follow-up question 6 take more risks 7 stay close to mom and family eighth win an Oscar for best actor 9 look back and enjoy the view 10. Just keep
living.
Where were you
and when were you when you wrote These 10 goals?
I was in a top bunk in the Delta Tau Delta house believe my roommate was Monte Wheels. I'm still friends with today from Montgomery, Alabama. There's the top bunk. I think I'd just probably it was the end. It was the end of the night at about 9:30. I was just getting nestling in for a good night's sleep. So I just started what was the food 893 was a month in the month and the day
that was September 1st 1993 first, okay.
Yes, so I just done I just finished dazed confused.
That's right. Yes to date two days after
finishing. Yeah. I just finished it of job summer. Hobby thing that there were three lines written in a script that I got cast in because I went to the right bar at the right time met the right guy red for it. Richard linklater said come on and started throwing me and seeing so three lines turned into three weeks work. I
Loved it was getting paid three hundred twenty dollars a day. People would tell me I was good at it and I was running around going like is this legal? It's so fun. And I finish it. My father had just passed away like two weeks earlier. Yeah, August 17th of that year. So I just finished a job. That was a hobby that now that became a career. I had just finished that thing about if you do the math, I didn't think about it till now. I just finished that OG mandino 10 months of reading that book wow father.
Just passed away. I was just going through what that meant to me and what that what I felt like that should mean to me and that's what the just keep living comes from to keep his Spirit Alive, even though he's physically not here keep things alive that he taught me that he'd keep me incentivize throughout my life, even though I couldn't rely on him personally being here to back me up with him. And so I remember writing those goals down. And the thing is that when you start off the conversation going, I don't know what your what Your adjective or adverb or was about it, but I found
that just less than a year ago in my Diaries and I never looked at it or remembered that I had written it.
Since the day I did that date on that list. I never looked at that list again. I wrote it that night.
And forgot about it, or at least I thought I forgot about it. Yeah. Yeah, I didn't and that's the wild part because somewhere subconsciously I obviously did remember it because so far I've accomplished those goals and there's some very specific ones on there that I'm like what you know, I always thought even the acting part win an Oscar for best actor. This is a time. I just finished dazed confused. I didn't know I was going to end up being an actor. I still thought didn't have the courage to even think I could pursue it as a career. I that time I thought it was.
Just be a hobby. I had a hobby for summer. But obviously when I look back I'm like, oh you did want to be you didn't want to be an actor and you wanted to be a damn good one so I could admit it on my journal page, but I couldn't admit it to myself how I couldn't even admit it in my dreams, but I could admit it on the journal pages. So that's why I was those are so those are three big things going on in my life. And I'd say the most, you know, the biggest shapeshifter was father moving on and but that with finishing days to with finishing.
And the greatest salesman, that's when I wrote that it's
that's quite a Venn diagram as far as a snapshot in time goes with those three sort of momentous changes those transitions if we zoom in on number five be an egotistical utilitarian. Do you recall what you meant when you wrote
that a hundred percent? I'd written a highlighter that next year. Maybe it was my junior year. I wrote a lava paper an essay John Wayne Goes West the egotistical.
Utilitarian and I guess it was me writing a story about a fictional character that I guess was based on me going west tollywood with the egotistical utilitarian always like well, that's it. That's what the real profits are. That's what Jesus up to making decisions. That's that's the honey hole of when we are really concede or have satisfaction or live life the most truest where the decisions we make for the eye.
II for
ourselves the selfish
decisions are actually what's best for the most amount of people utilitarian are the eye where the eye meets the we wear the selfish is the self less where what I need is what I want and what I want is the ego. What I need is the utilitarian what I want is freedom. What I need is the responsibility and the interplay of those things. What I is the ego and utilitarian is the
Active utilitarian we that I was already starting to work in a lot of that. These thematics are through the book because they're inherently how I see life and have for a long time. But that was I was like, oh that's the ultimate human the egotistical utilitarian where the decision one makes for themselves. Most selfishly happened to be the most selfless decisions as well at the same time and where those two overlap and are one. That's the ultimate human. That was the
pursuit.
So that was my
belief that in
why take more risks we might come back to egotistical utilitarianism. Why take more risks. Did you feel like a time? You weren't taking enough risks. Was it something you would learned about risks from your parents or other people why take more
risks? I think I was at that time seeing risk that I'd take really pay off the risk to in the bar at the top of the Hyatt that night to go down and introduce myself to Don Phillips who end up being a
Director of a daze confused who four hours later at the end of the night after we got kicked out of the bars is a you ever done any acting you might be right for this part taking that the the risk to go and read for that part the risk for Richard linklater say there's nothing you're not supposed to be in this scene. You're not written in this scene, but you think what are some would be in it the risk for me to go? Oh, yeah and just hop in the middle of the scene and improvise and play those risks were paying off.
Off I was be also beginning to feel the risk that I took reading that damn book. Very salesman the first book I ever read cover to cover and it's a thin paper back mind you it takes two months to read but that was a risk for me and I was feeling very confident with who I was I was also thrown upside down by my dad moving on now. I don't know, you know, if you've lost a parent but is the son losing a dad you want to talk about forced into identity, you know.
Dad being this sort of crutch just because he was alive and above government and above law was now gone. I had no crutch. I had no safety net all of a sudden. I remember this very clearly this coming to me besides to just keep living with keeping his Spirit Alive. I remembered one of the first lessons of him moving on was I was and I carved this in a tree carving this deeply in a tree for about 3 hours one night less impressed more involved. Hmm and that
leans into taking more risk because I was like after dad moved on I was like, oh all of these mortal things in life that I remember reverence for even this point of just finishing acting and maybe having to look do you know dreams of Fame? Wow, all these things that I revered that were mortal lowered down to eye level and at the same time everything that I noticed that I was condescending.
Or looking down upon or something my nose that are going to know that's that's crap or oh, they're no good. I would like they raised up to eye level and I remember going. Oh the World is Flat your dad's moved on. You better look the world in the eye and by seeing the world flat. I saw a further I saw wider. I saw more clearly I had more courage. I lost reverence for the Mortal things that I had reverence for. I still respected them, but I lost reverence for them. So that gave me courage and I lost this sort of
Snub-nosed look at things that I thought were beneath me and I am powered them and they raised up Die Level. So all of a sudden, you know, that was a version where the I met the we for me that was a version where what I looked up to maybe too much met what I was looking down on and it was right in front of me. And that was how I was also taking more risk. I lost a lot of fear. I'd I still had fear but I gained a lot of courage to go meet my fears and I didn't give enough Creed.
Two things that are probably shouldn't fear are have too much reverence for because they were mortal and I was like, what's that that's you know reverence for fame or not taking a chance to go get what you want. That's a mortal fear. That's like putting a limit on yourself on kind of why would you do that? I even called it a sin at that time not to take certain risk and would feel guilty if I didn't and feel like I didn't do my due diligence. I didn't I didn't I didn't meet my quote that day in God.
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Why did you start using a diary or what has that helped you to do or given you over your Decades of doing it because I've spoken to many people on this podcast who Journal often they have different forms of journaling including a name. We talked about very briefly before recording Josh waitzkin, very different approaches a very different reasons. What is it that you've gotten from having a diary and maybe it's changed over time.
Yeah, it's evolved. I mean
Diary started off like I think most people's Diaries. Do you write things down when you're not in a good place or you're lost and you know my early diary entries were the why what where when house you know,
the existential question
of what is going on. Does it matter who am I? Oh my God, this should so my girlfriend broke up with me. I lost it started off with that. So I've noticed that I started writing down when I was in times of distress or disillusion and then
I started to say well, wait a minute. You gotta just like that augmenting a book by hook or by crook. You read it three times a day. I was like, we're going to write my diary everyday McConaughey. And so when did I when do when do most of us including me not right in our diary when things are going great. Oh, I got it figured out. I'm not gonna need you take time to go be introspective and write down my thoughts everything to everything is a green light. It's great. Well, no I said, hang on a second. We're going to
Pindar life a diary original use of a diary is to dissect failure or or disillusion. I think there's some prudent and let's dissect success. Let's dissect what's going on when things are going well. That's let's write in this diary when you feel like everything's clear and you feel strong and confident significant and you feel like yourself. So I started writing in my diary when things are going well and then started to map out certain things about found that what that did is when I
I would get in a proverbial rut later. I could go back to that diary and look at what was I writing? What was I doing when I felt like everything was lickety-split and I had it everything handled and I found consistencies. I found it from what I was eating to who I was hanging out with how much sleep I was getting two beauties in the world that I was noticing and really were affecting me how I approach people. How is approaching the day how is approaching conflict? How is approaching and taking in things that
Success and I found consistencies and then so sometimes it's going back in those Diaries reading what I was writing when things were going well would help get me out of a rut later on in life when I wasn't doing so well and I remember this early on in college. It's a reason that my buddy as its mentioned earlier. Ah, Bill Maher said you should go into storytelling business is I was writing short stories, but I was also writing things down idiosyncrasies. I myself was really going to get to know myself. I would always when I'd be in a movie theater.
Later, I always laughed. I thought the funniest jokes. I'd laugh. I be the only one laughing in the theater and I never thought the stuff that everybody laughs that was funny the collective laughs I never even giggle that was like Alan very funny, but I'll add Halas without that like and no one else will happen is like no one else thinks it's funny. I would say that in the theater. I found that I cried at things that other people didn't cry out. Like I've never really cried a death.
Weep Earth begins always have made me cry more than proverbial ends. So I started writing these things down and first was feeling like are you weird? Okay, is this Odd as this is this? Okay. Can you be this kind of a person and got the comments go? Yes, you can it's okay, but let's write down those things. Let's write down. What makes you laugh. What makes you happiest what makes you sad what makes you angry and don't worry if it's the collective choice of
majority just what what does it mean to you and write those things in and so that led to
Character I believe it led to my own character led to me being able to maybe go play different characters to understand than empathize with different people and have the that different people have different things that turn them on and turn them off at different times. Why green
lights. What is the concept or the intent behind using that word? What does it represent for you? Well one, it's just pretty cool to Idaho.
No, I mean I wouldn't get started. It's a I mean I you know, I went through the be very Earnest but not very good student Independent films of a freshman or sophomore student. Like I was you know, we're trying to work out something as extension or you want to sound really cool. Like, you know, I went through forced Winters, you know, and I mean because I have in the book what I would call a lot of forced Winters mind you I call this covid timer and right now I forced winter. I had a you know, my most creative times came in my
worst winters of life my year in Australia abroad on my own but forced Winters kind of a double negative. I mean who wants to go open the book called forced winners? I mean so great - what's more affirmative and in and I love verbs. I love words that that are verbs verb is the holy word as I'm sure you know and that it has affirmation. It has its alive and so green lights. I noticed became a theme to the book because the metaphor of the yellow and the red lights that we have in our life, whatever those hard times.
Our I noticed in going through my Diaries of 36 years that things that were definite red lights in my life hard times yellow lights in my life interruptions interventions things that stopped my flow and gotten my our way that at some point either sometimes immediately or decades down the line.
Revealed their Greenlight Assets in my life. I would argue. My Dad's passing was a green light now. His dying was a literal red light, but as I mentioned earlier, I would not be the man. I am right now if he did not move on I would have stayed lazy. I would have stayed more impressed and less involved. I would have not put myself to task and held myself and called myself to Arms to man up and be more.
Honest with myself and look at the world more honestly and have more courage if he had not passed on because I would have had him as a crutch. I would have had this sort of subconscious Reliance that oh if I really getting a bona still got that I still got pop Hill. He's my safety net. So his passing reveals dream lights for me. So green lights became a theme and it became a I noticed that sometimes it's about persisting through something enduring something other times. It's about pivoting. Wait a minute. I'm banging my head on the wall here. I'm basically
really living out the definition of insanity trying to change something the same way over and over again. It's not changing. So I need to re-approach this need to back up and then maybe dance around the situation dance around the problem to get what I want and then other times I noticed it's just you raise the White Flag. No, you know what I'm fighting for the wrong thing here. This is going against my grain. This is not really what I what I want and need so I'm gonna live to fight another day and go find something else to challenge to overcome and so all in those are methods in which
I've been able to find green light. Sometimes I've got green lights and think we all do by just sheer straight-ass denial. I mean I write that line in the in that great lesson its wisdom. I heard from The Very Old Man one time. You know, I've had many crashes at thousands across this is in my life. He'll most of them never happened. I mean that partially you get that by just denying that there is a crisis not being foolish with it. But some things have just said like I'm not even going to give that crisis credit therefore it doesn't
Exist there that dark can't stick to me if you throw it at me. If I don't give it that if I don't even give credit that it's a dart, you know what I mean? So so that's that's that's green lines. I mean, ultimately I believe that in the rearview mirror of our life every red and yellow light will turn green and that may not even be in this life Tim. I think a lot of people it happens for people in this life tomorrow next week next month next year 10 years from now on our Deathbed.
But I if we didn't happen then I think it can happen.
In the next life for our kids or for our kids kids our grandkids. It's a lesson maybe realize three five ten Generations from now. It may become a green light for some hardship that we go through in this life now.
Well, there are million directions. We can go I have eight options and that'll make sense. That's my favorite up. Yeah, it's well, you know that would make sense is as soon as you hear where I'm going with it. So there are a number of themes.
That emerge in this book which which I take to be as you've mentioned a Playbook of sorts and helping you to either change your reality or change how you see that reality in the service of engineering or recognizing green lights of different types. Right and the a themes that I've written down here. I'm going to let you take dealer's choice on so you're right. I'd like to pick one Annex and explore so one Outlaw logic to
To find your frequency 3 dirt roads and autobahns for I like the sound of this one the art of running downhill 5 Turn the Page Six the arrow doesn't seek the target the target seeks the arrow 7 be brave comma take the hill eight live your legacy. Now, where should we go? First good, sir.
Oh, geez, these are fun. Look, let's start. I want to get to our running downhill because that one I know ticket juice. So maybe we should just bring start with that one and we should we should maybe hit dirt roads as well dirt roads and all the bombs.
Realtor, let's do dirt roads not about real quick. It's because it's simple it's a simple flip on the I think it's Robert Frost. You know, The Road Less taken has made all the difference, you know, is that Robert Frost?
You know, I'm sure that my listeners or my team will tell
us really if it's not forgive the Mallet prop but you know the quote The Road Less Traveled The Road Less Traveled was made all the different right? Well that always has been like take the dirt road don't go with the majority goes, you know, and I remember
Were in film school I was the frat boy button-down shirt jeans and boots hand-shaker nonsensical love the sunshine and I was in a class with a bunch of all the filming it was the gothic group. They all wore black t-shirts. They did they stayed in the shadows. They were there Shades they kind of huddled in the back. I remember one of our classes was one of the things were saying it will go see a movie this weekend. Come back money. Talk about your movie.
I've come back and talk about, you know die hard and soon as I started talking about what I liked about it. I'd be like, oh gosh, that's tough shit man's corporate sellout crap and I'd be like, oh geez and I remember they did, you know, they'd all gone to the eisenstein Revival that weekend and we'll talk about that and I remember being really intimidated going like wow.
They're artists.
I'm not yeah. Yeah,
I gotta I gotta I gotta untuck
my shirt here a little bit. I
gotta
I gotta quit going outside and I got a not appreciate the sunshine. I gotta I gotta quit singing out loud. I gotta I gotta get more him less she in here, you know and and just that was you're going through that mental midget ation on myself. I remember coming back again another week after week and I've seen a movie and I had gone to the multiplex again.
Tina popular movie and brought it up and of course the cat calls from all the other filmmakers in the class all in black hole ups are going to its corporate shit. Nobody sees that that's a sellout and I remember instead of backing down this time. I went I went wait a minute. Did you see how do you know? It's corporate shit. How do you notice what makes you say that and they all stopped and kind of started looking at each other and started stuttering.
And then finally one time goes well, I mean we didn't see it. I mean, we don't know but I mean we just you know, and I went up fuck you.
Oh
man, that's it off this time. I thought y'all been seeing it and you got this we haven't even gone to see it. So that was where it hit me. I was like, oh there I was thinking that the road less taken, you know, sometimes a dirt road. My dirt road was the Autobahn of the multiplex, you know.
Might there there there dirt road, you know would have been what it would have been the same they needed to go see that go see a popular Studio Movie before just calling it off as nothing sometimes, you know, if there were two and I've had in my life. Someone say someone's an agoraphobic their dirt road is getting out, you know, someone who's a bit of a Hermit or socially uncomfortable their dirt road is being an extrovert.
Go out engage practiced it so it was a flip on that that sometimes it's you know, The Road Less taken can be a dirt road. Yes anytime path less taken and other times for some people some of us in our times in our life. It's an Autobahn and sometimes you know, I've used to be so extroverted. I never would spend time with myself reading a book or doing introspection. Well, that was a dirt road for me to take some introspect now shoot sometimes I
Have been introspective so much. I like being in my darkroom writing more than I like engaging with people. Well, my dirt road sometimes now is like put the pen down McConaughey get your ass out in the world and go engage in the daylight get out there. So it changes for us and sometimes dirt road sometimes is
not a bomb and it is Robert Frost I can
come on. Thank you Robert. Yeah, the other one that got tickled you on the way down as the art of running downhill now may I actually ask a
follow-up to the dirt roads and Otto?
Oh bonds, so it seems like if I'm hearing you correctly and understanding that it is a proactive approach to facing the discomforts that you may have or the hesitation that you may need to face at least in part. It seems like that is part of the lesson and the person who introduced us Ryan holiday had encouraged me to ask you about stoicism which seems to in some respect tie into that.
Many stoics least historically those people we've read about would take periods of time to do the things that would lead them to discomfort. Do you have any just just as a side Avenue here? Do you have any perspectives on
stoicism? I mean, I think I do but you're going to I'm probably going to botch this up because I don't exactly know the vernacular of the stoics near as well as you and Ryan to I will say this, you know as other book obstacles that is the way and I've touched on this in my book a lot in my own way. Look,
The need for resistance then the need to choose the right.
Harder challenge, they're really need to choose a hard decision for the right reasons the need to choose the obstacles for which to overcome or at least attempt to overcome is very very wise engagement. The need is I talk about in my book. What have you done to get away and go off on your own and be stuck with yourself, even if it's the worst fucking company you've ever had that is a good thing to do. There is a good valuable pain.
Isn't there are green lights in that forcing your red lights it forcing yourself into the red light of being stuck with the only person you can't get rid of even though you hate him. And yes, I use that word and I've had those times and in those times of groveling and discomfort and I can't sleep and I'm throwing up and I can't get the monkeys off my back and I got through guilt and oh my God, I'm lost but I got nowhere to go. I got no one to reach out to I don't have a phone on a car ain't got a friend.
We're going through that those sleepless night and going when is this going to end and going through well?
Alright McConaughey. What are we going to forgive? And what are we going to say enough? So fucking enough and we're changing that our lives and let's shake hands on this because you're the only son of a bitch I can't get rid of
let's if you don't mind I want to take it and this is just the nature of my Perhaps unfocused Perhaps nonlinear mind. We're going to come back to the art of running downhill. I will not forget but you're talking about you were talking about the paying the penance.
Of spending time with yourself the red light of solitude that can create green lights. Why did you write this book as I understand it or you went away to the desert by yourself for 52 days without electricity is this true the
first 12 days were no electricity the other 40 were limited electricity in places, but it was five different trips. I took two to solitary confinement each time. So I spread about I had to come home and take care of some honeydews and check in.
With the family make sure everything is running good at the homestead before my wife sit me off again and said get out of here and don't come back to you got something.
So Solitude seems to be also a through line at least a practice of sorts. Yeah any other commentary on on Solitude and in those moments when you're spending time with yourself or that which I guess is all the time, but I want to know do you have in your inner monologue a difference between when you say your last name to yourself? And your first name?
Do you ever use your first name when you're talking to yourself?
I know I you know a good question. Well, let me tell you what the best of the best thing for Mike Tyson the future for this is what Mike Tyson once it is you I've thought about that. It's a fun thing to talk about yourself in the third person. But when you're in a Socratic dialogue, you got to give your other self a name and I guess I'll call my McConaughey and I you know these days.
Logs, let's talk about those that you know this the that old adage. Oh don't talk to yourself. What bullshit do talk to yourself. What I think we need to remember to do is when we're asking ourselves these questions just make sure we answer If all we're doing is ask myself questions, but never coming up with an answer. Well that can lead to some very imbalanced Insanity at
times. That's a really really important point. I just want to pause to let
Sink in for people I did so please continue but that is so so important just looking back at my depressive periods that I've experienced. It's what I'm asking a lot of questions and not actually taking the time to sit down and write down the answers. We think about answers.
Yeah or force yourself to remain in the discomfort of the question.
Instead of going I give where's the bottle or where's you know, where's some attention or you know, where's where's something some entertainment? Where's the TV, you know, I mean so I can get my mind off of it. Don't abort situation. Don't abort the times when we got the questions now mind you, you know, I've had you know, and some of those times when I'm going off and I know it's going to be a we're going to I'm going to don't know how long it's gonna be till I come out the other side. I've had to take a helmet.
Chin, strap and a mouth guard and put padding on the walls, you know, because I knew it was going to be a wrestling match with the Mets in the Me So and I've kept the floor before I got it's nice when you go off to do these things to go. Let's check the floor. Make sure there's no broken glass where let's remove the sharp objects because this is going to get four dimensional and you know, so but
to stick in there with it and to go through the withdrawal of the not knowing the go through the drawl of the questions and I don't mean withdrawal from it from a substance go through withdrawal of not getting along with yourself is I mean a great thing to do and it's hard for a reason but again that goes back to what you said it stay there to you answer it wait till you get an answer wait to you either figure out what you're forgiving and figure out what you're going to you what you had enough of what you're like, no. No, I'm not putting up with that part of myself anymore. We're not going to keep being.
Repeat offender on that McConaughey or dimmer, you know what I mean, and we're going to change and then all of a sudden there comes from Grace you come out the other side and the car. Okay now I'm stuck with my buddy. The one I can't get rid of if we're going to do this least we shook hands and you're not perfect, but we're moving forward and we've evolved a little bit because of this time that we forced to spend with ourselves yet to answer those or stick with it or you know to evolve the conversation.
And from where it was when you first went into Solitude at least, you know, so I'm a fan of people talk to themselves and say it's remember to answer yourself, you know, you know, you have it a one-way. It's not a Socratic dialogue unless you can respond
the art of running downhill. What is the art of running downhill? Okay,
so I get successful. I
Scott major Fame very quickly after A Time to Kill came out with film. I did 96 and I mean from the Friday Friday afternoon before it came out to the Monday after the week and it came out. My whole world was inverted the world. All of a sudden was one big mirror. I never meet strangers since that day. It was inverted. I mean that Friday afternoon before time to kill comes out.
There's a hundred scripts out there I want to do now I want to do all of you kidding me. I'll do any of them.
Well, 99 know you can't one of them. Yes, you can well in a matter of two days after that film opened that we can indeed. Well that hundred scripts. It was yes, you can do 99 one know so I was like, whoa, two days ago would have done any of these and could only do one and now it's only two days later, but you tell me I can leave 99 of them help me discernment discrimination. Can I make a choice? Who am I? Jeez what I want to
Do there's only 24 hours in the day is last I checked I need more. So I was a little you know, imbalanced overwhelmed what didn't have my feet my soul on the ground and there were times that and I also remember that same lawyer I talked about the oil The Mink Story Jerry Harris. I remember him telling me he reached out and talk to him for years. He reaped out and he goes, hey Matthew from a small town Uvalde, Texas, you know, you came through Longview Texas. Now you went out there. Now, you're famous Hollywood star and you got all these things he goes.
Make sure you don't suffer Too Much from the non deserving complex
that happens with some people that get real successful from sort of humble
beginnings and it made a lot of sense to me because I was noticing that you know in the name of obstacles being the way I was creating obstacles for myself some of them very unnecessary. Meaning here's my life. I'm successful. I'm rolling. I'm catching green lights. I am going I'm rolling downhill.
I very less than gracefully handled some of my success I would become belligerent at times. I didn't become belligerent trying to promote the end of the always say this don't you know, it's okay to have a point to prove just don't always be trying to prove a point. Well, it many times Robin try to prove a point. You know what I mean? And it was my own insecurities with my own self trying to find some balance in this it was me. I've seen the mendacity is of all these people in Hollywood all of a sudden saying I love you and
Like I've said that for people in my life and everyone says that here so they're full of shit that it was David's I was taking things personally even and sort of sabotaging some of the red carpet Wine & Caviar that was being handed to me. You know what I mean? And I was slipping to some of my more banal self it times and doing a proverbial faceplant meaning I'm running downhill.
And since this is all Easy Street, I need resistant. So I think I'm going to trip myself and faceplant and break my right into the concrete so I can break my nose so I can gah. There you go. Now I'm earning it. Now. I feel it now. I burned it now I deserve it.
Well, that can be a little foolish. There's an art to going downhill. And so what I noticed was oh hard times you're going to come it's going to get dry. You're not going to be able to do whatever script you want to do and kind of had her times or in a relationship we go through it doesn't go well or someone gets sick in the family a real uphill battle enters our life and so the art of running downhill.
Eels about a enjoy it when you're going downwind downhill don't trip yourself because that up hills comment. All right, it's going to be it's going to come whether you want it to or not. So don't trip yourself in face plant right now because you're gonna have to work your ass off here very
shortly. Anyway, let's talk about perhaps an uphill perhaps a pause perhaps something else which I'd love for you to comment on which did come later and that was a decision which
Love to explore to say no to quite a lot of opportunities for period of time. It sees Eames like at one point you're very successful. He became very famous. Like you said practically overnight you're being offered opportunities. You couldn't have imagined a week prior and you have a string of successes and then you realize well, wait a minute here. I might be getting painted into a corner and you start to say no you start to turn.
Down say action film opportunities with big paychecks things like that. Yeah, was that hard to do did other people say that you are doing the right thing and encourage you could you walk us through and just tell a story about that experience love to so, this
is around. I don't remember the year. I'm guessing it's around 12 13 years ago. I was rolling with the romantic comedies. I had taken the Baton from Hugh Grant and was the Rive the the male lead rom-com go
Guy rom coms are mid-level budgets 30 35 million. They offer a good front end paycheck to me. They go make 60 million. I mean it the Studio's don't have to overspend and spend hundreds of millions of dollars to make them you get a good female to male lead that have good chemistry people love to go escape to my wrong comes are doing well. They were my bank. They were what Hollywood banked on me to be in the same time. I'm living in Malibu learn to serve got my shirt off and the pop right to your
Discovery channel is that gamma is documenting this and I'm like damn right document it. This is the life. I'm living. I love it. I worked and earned to get this life and those romantic comedies that I get paid. So handsomely for actually pay the rent at the house on the beach that I live in in front of this water that I'm surfing it. So how is full-on shaking hands with gun? Yes at the same time. I did notice that.
Any other dramas I wanted to do or even the way people sort of when I said don't meet strangers anymore. Evenly this sort of people thought of me or approached me or talk to me or about me. There's no consideration. It was it was it was like McConaughey's the shirts rom-com guy and I was like, yeah, I am and I'm
But they're only I could answer that second question of and I'm only acting continue that that that sent no one else could ever like Hollywood for sure was like no nothing else in solving dramas. I wanted to do or other pictures. No one want to make it with me. And I remember I just we just had Levi come on. I just had our first son and my life was so vital man. I just had a newborn. I've met the woman that
Love and want to spend the rest of my life with laughing harder. I'm crying harder. I'm happier than ever life is very vital and I'm in it. My real life is but my work feels like yeah, I could do that tomorrow morning. He's giving this Kryptonite. Let me look at I could do it tomorrow. It wasn't really challenging me and the rom-coms weren't challenged me and my lifestyle was one big green light and you know too many it's all green lights. That's all.
All sugar and Candy will bring they'll make Tire into anybody. So I was saying oh I really want my wish my work. Could I remember saying this at least Montgomery looking in the mirror actually going? Okay McConaughey. So if your life is more vital and true to who you are then your work. Well, it's got to be one of the other that's a good thing because I know a lot of people that their work is more vital than their life. So I said that's a good thing I said, but geez, can I just get some work that might challenge the Vitality of my life and the man
I am in it where I can get some work. I can be more me in it. Well those roles were not being offered to me nothing. Nope. Not a chance. We won't know Studio Bank you in this drama row or this other role you want I had control of Dallas Buyers Club at that time, but no one wanted to make it for me nor anyone Finance it so I decided that if I couldn't do what I wanted to do. And what I want to do is not being offered to me. It would be prudent for me to just stop doing what
I had been doing and what was in the pipeline continually coming to me which were the romantic comedies I called. My money manager said. All right. Look, I'm going to stop doing the only work I'm getting offered and I don't know how long it's gonna be till I work again. How am I doing that money? He says you've invested well conservatively you're fine. You can take that long. I remember calling my agent Jim Toth at see a gym. I don't we do romantic comedies more. I remember this conversation goes great. I can wait. What? What do you mean great because great I go.
You
say that so quick. What are you going to say Monday morning? When you go into your superiors in the office and say McConaughey's not doing romantic comedies and McConaughey's been bringing it nice chunk of 10% commission into you guys with these romantic comedies for years. Now. He said the coolest thing to me because I don't work for them. I work for you.
Hi, that's a good
line the line, right? So the and it was I went to Camilla. All right, and I'd been you know, I shed quite a few tears with her going through this, you know, my my my
feeling fraudulent my work. Do I feel a lack of significant in my work? I feel like you know, is it okay to be feeling you know this I mean, like I said member I'm them do as we said earlier. I'm I'm Connor going running downhill. Why would you sabotage not doing the work you're getting off would you can get paid so handsomely to do it, but she understood that my soul was shaken and needed some recalibration and that the work I was doing wasn't the true sort of expression of
I was in my life and I was I told her I said I won't get fined hold out for some work that can challenge the Vitality of the life that I'm living with you and our son Levi and she repeated the lines to me. She goes, okay, you're going to get wobbly I've been around you. You got to work Matthew and you love to accomplish. You're going to get wobbly you might start, you know reaching for a little sip of something to drink earlier in the day two and I'm like, yeah, she's like, yeah she goes
Days are going to be longer. We don't know how long this will last. How long will be in this week. She called it a desert how long this will be a desert she goes, but if we're gonna do this if you're going to do this
We're not going to half-ass it. You repeat it. My dad's line to me and I went. Yes, ma'am. Gave her a hug put them tears on her shoulder and we said starting today no more rom-coms. Well rom-com offers came into my agent for about the next six months but nothing but rom-com offers and I didn't even unless it was a major offer. Well, I just said no and they stopped at my age is desk Jim don't know and then one of them came through
That was like a gargantuan offer for it. And my agent said it's a pretty damn good script to and so I said we'll send it at let me read it. And I remember this the offer was like four.
Eight million dollars and the script is pretty good when but it was still a coat of a rom-com and I remember reading it and going no, thank you. I remember feeling sort of emboldened and strengthened by saying No, thank you. Great sticking to my guns. No rom-coms six months into this drought. Nope not cave it in now don't half-ass it McConaughey. So they come back with a ten million dollar offer.
No, thank you. They come back with a twelve point five
million dollars.
Now I go dot dot dot ellipse it's allergic to no. No, thank you. Maddie come back with a fifteen million dollar offer. Wow, you know what? Let me have another reread of that script and I reread that you know, what at 15 million dollars the same script that I've been offered.
Eat me not the 15 million dollar offer script which was the same exact words is the 8 million dollar offer script. The 50 million dollars could was better. It was
funnier.
It had
possibilities.
It had angles I had ideas I could make this work, you know, I mean this could work now I'm imagining at this point. Jim
is like man this say no thing is really working out. He's he's
in and he's out there teetering like
I know what we said, you know, but it did bring all her sentence not like to pretty good script. I know it's rom-com. It's pretty good script, but I said no. No, thank you. Well that got the signal across Hollywood that McConaughey was taking a serious sabbatical and so don't even send him a rom-com. It got around to
that was kind of The Crucible that I mean that was like the Crux move in a
sense in a way that was that was a
Yeah, I called an audible six months in and they had I'm thinking I might cave I might just be posturing and come on back McConaughey. We love you. And I said No, and when they had pump the money off her up so much and people knew in the industry what that offer was it became very clear. Oh, oh shit. Okay. We kind of I don't know what he's doing, but he ain't doing this stuff. We not do anymore rom-coms and it became clear. So for the next
food 12 14 months
Nothing came in NADA zilch not an offer for anything. I mean, I'd check talk to my age and every couple of weeks. It just be like nothing came in nothing. So now we're 20 months into this desert period I do have my son to raise which you know being a father has always been the most important thing to me. So that that's got my compass at least directed in a place that I go just trust in this if you if it has something to do with raising your son and being here on the land with your family.
That even if you start to wander just trust that that's always going to be in the asset section McConaughey you you can't go wrong with that. So I stuck to that and I was now fine with not do any work. I didn't know what I was going to be in the know if I was going to change my career if I was going to become a teacher coach or go back to being a lawyer. I didn't know I didn't think so, but I was writing more I was talk about forced winners. I put a force winner on myself and I was
Pretty content. I wasn't you know waking up every morning going didn't offer come into something new come in. I was past that and then all of a sudden 20 months in 2021 months into this desert get stuck in some offers that are interesting things William freaking Killer Joe Lee Daniels Paperboy, Jeff Nichols wrote mud for me Steven Soderbergh called Magic wine Richard linklater and I go do Bernie together True Detective comes around all of a sudden Dallas Buyers Club. No one still
Oh wants to you know, put a bunch of money up for a 1980s period drama that aids but all of a sudden McConaughey all the directors were no directors would do Dallas Buyers Club with me they wanted they wanted the script. They loved the script. They don't want to do it on Kane all of a sudden we find John Mark fellow who won who says no, I'd like to do with McConaughey. So what happened was that 22 months or whatever that drought desert I unknown brand.
I didn't Rebrand a unbranded me being away me being in Texas not being on a beach.
Getting pictures to be shirtless on a beach not being in rom-coms. I was out of the world's view. I was out of the industry's view. I was not your living room. I was not in your theater. I was not in any of the places that the world have become expectant to see me and how to see me. Where was I I was gone. Where is McConaughey? Well, you're gone long enough all of a sudden. I became a new good idea.
Which I was not a new good idea it anytime earlier than that at the end of that 20-month period and then all of a sudden the things came to me that I wanted to do and I remember saying you know, what fuck the Bucks I'm going through the experience if I read a role that shakes me in my boots and challenges the Vitality that I feel in my own real life and challenges me the man. I am in my own real life. That's what I'm going after and man they came in come on. I looked at each other. She had some more tears and she
she we said let's get after it and I just started hammering them. The family came with me everywhere. I went and just started laying down work that really really turn me on
so I want to dig into a few follow-up questions here CC your wife probably with some Sage for site. Although I'm guessing said you're going to get wobbly days are going to seem longer you might reach for that bottle a little earlier than you would normally what were some of your practices or some of the inputs that
Due to either Stave off getting wobbly or to recover when you did get wobbly
good question. Look my family. My mom. My brothers supported me. They thought I was plumb crazy for you know, turning down that 50 million dollar offer and sitting there going like what are you doing? They thought I really was face planting while running while having a downhill ramp to run down. They were like one who in their right mind. Would you're not working. Do you like that? I was like, yeah that works.
Easy, I like and they're offering you. What the hell is your problem? But they knew you know, they knew that I was like
You know that I was a thinker they known that she's long before that that I took myself, you know in those circumstances seriously and that I was doing some soul-searching and that and they thought I would they think they were like that make sense to us, but we get it little brother. You know, you're all right. Good luck. So they did support me. I'll say this this this helped we had a very real crisis in the family with someone in my family that needed all of my attention and all of my time meaning
One of those real red lights that entered our life a real crisis that a real uphill battle entered which gave me a large sense of purpose necessary purpose like it's not what this one is unequivocal things. You don't question. It's like if I had gotten any job I wanted in Hollywood have a script to go act at that time. Even then I wouldn't have done it during going through this family crisis. This was Paramount. It was unequivocally the thing to take care of. So as you probably know or the death of
In a family or a big fat real family crisis that that'll sober you up and I don't mean Soviet from the bottle that'll sober you up from missing any sort of again the scripts at that time movies making movies. That was a mortal thing dealing with his family crisis was an immortal thing. So I behaved became very involved with handling this family crisis and that is where my identity was that coupled with.
My son's being raised he to Brand New Day for him every single day. He's getting to know me how awesome is this that I'm get to have this time because I know I'll go back and do some work somewhere somehow later and it's not going to not going to have this time. So let's lean into the assets of being forced here with your son. You're building a home with woman you love and you've got this family crisis that you are dealing with which is bringing new clothes to your clothes back leaving closer to your blood family.
So I was Finding purpose and and all of that and you know as it usually happens as it goes it was getting to the point where well, I don't care if anything comes in. I'm not even thinking about it if any work comes in.
All right care.
Of course, that's about the time that the work comes
in. You've traveled very unorthodox path in many respects. What are some of the biggest misconceptions if any what are common misconceptions about you that you hope or that you could clarify either right now or we're through the pages of this book there. Are there any of their enemies into any misconceptions
positive or positive or negative? Yeah. I mean look one misconception, I think.
Which it used to concern me more so than it does now is that may God everyone a lot of people think that I sort of like just wake up in the morning and go roll out of bed and say all right. Where's my mark? What are we doing today? What's this scene about what's life about what's responsibility today? What is oh, yeah. Okay. Yeah. A lot of people think I just winged it and the truth is
Like I was telling you earlier about me being a studier and love in my eyes. I am a preparer. I that's I know a lot of My Success and satisfaction have come from being majorly prepared and when I'm majorly prepared I prepare so I can so it's not work when I get in the game I prepared. So that's the work. My work is pregame.
When I'm in the game, I am what I'm best at being in the game. I am that guy that looks like I just woke up in the morning. Just hey, what's up to make it look easy comes from the preparation. So I daily prepared know whether it's work or trying to be the best man. I can and be the best husband the best father died constantly trying to work on that. You know, I had the same with you know, and now you reading the story of my mom and dad had very physical and oftentimes violent loud.
Attention hence divorced twice married three times me I remember last time I raise my voice to my wife or kids because for me if I even get to the point where after raise my voice for I get, you know start to feel like I'm going to snap I immediately my threshold goes to what will will will what did you not handle up to this point McConaughey to let it get to this there's you dude.
Have some crumbs somewhere.
In your position as a husband a father or a man to get to this point. So let's not stop. Let's go back and deconstruct how we got to this point even feel like this because you drop the ball somewhere along the way to eat this beef and I have a pretty short threshold for that feeling of what will let me recalibrate. Let me let me let me take some stock and how I got to this point because I feeling like I'm about to snap. I'm feeling like maybe going to raise my voice. So, you know, that's
Some recalibrations that I inherently in instinctually if I say it practice some but I just that's where my head and heart goes
is that in truth? It does it does I think that you know, what are the sort of Gestalt impressions of the book which is I mean really really fun and very delightful. I mean so congratulations on the book it's not easy to do of and and the the Gestalt impression is that you take
Introspection and I admit maybe this isn't the right way to phrase it but you take introspection seriously and you practiced a lot of introspection. So you've been able to take these moments that otherwise might be lost in the slipstream those moments of success where things seem to be going. Well, the the Lowe's and you've trapped them like flies in the Amber so that you can look at them later and even look at them like a flipbook so you can see the trends that take you in one direction or another and I and then that is
That is not common. This is a I'd like to just ask one or two more
questions next. Yeah, and that that I mean, I'm trying to get what I think we're all trying to get which I actually and let's talk with this because I do think it's common that we all want more Roi yes on ourselves on ourselves. And is there any less boring or Vitae or immediate entertaining and angering and interesting?
Object then us on ourselves to create. I mean, I'm trying to I know I'll never do it, but I'm trying to find some themes that support a science to be in satisfied and and I think we can all uncover those in our lives by our habits. Like I said earlier looking at you Diaries when you write in your diary when you get when things are going well dissect success as well as failure there become certain themes that it become like oh
Reliable, I have more satisfaction. I am more me I get more what I want. I am a better man. I'm a better woman when I am acting and doing these things going to these places thinking this way eating this spending time with these people thinking these thoughts.
There's a science to it. I don't think I'll ever get it but man what it's incredibly fun percent maddening, but what a riddle. Yeah to keep trying to figure out that will be
never-ending right? It's like keeping track of plays in The Game of Life. I mean, it's yeah. Yeah. I have to have the ability to look back at it. So, so if you were to have a billboard metaphorically speaking to get a message a question and image
Anything out to billions of people could have paragraph could be a word anything non-commercial what might you put on that billboard
a great question. And I think it's one that when I like to say I think about all the time because I do have a market tearing mine. It'd be two words with a question mark behind them. I value question mark Tim II don't know how to make systemic change. I don't not that interested in politics.
Seems to doesn't seem like the right. I don't know category maybe for those kind of leadership that I want to listen to or in some ways some forms be myself. It seems to me that the common denominator or the bipartisan nondenominational solid stepping stones for us to evolve as a species as a nation and as individuals
Is based on values the fundamental principles that we can all agree on I don't care what side of politics you're on or what religion you are. But what do we value? What do we really value? We all want to be relevant. Well, let's ask relevant for what? Yeah before we want to be
relevant. Let's let's let's
in what are those values that we can go? Oh, that's yeah if I act that way if I'm kind in that way if I'm accountable in that way if I have a sense of humor in that way. How does that?
Very selfish act because it's good for me good for my ego fills me up pays me back because me mailbox money is me green in my future, but it also gives you mailbox money. Mmm gives you it gives other people it gives others residuals and our futures compounding asset and I think we just we need to work on or and have fun understanding that that the things
We do today the choices we make are combating assets to what where we go in the future. And if we have make more valuable choices and give more respect to the competence of values our own personal values. We're buying more Roi we're creating more green lights in the future for ourselves and others. I
value question mark very important statement right there and question and I agree with you about the values and the all
For what right the the relevant? Yeah what it's such an important focusing modifier to adjectives. They get thrown around very commonly. And yeah,
you know that there's another line in there that I have it's based off that genes being pressed story is when we can ask ourselves if we want to before we do.
That's goes along with yelling be relevant what weight relevant for what you know, I mean it's just because we can and maybe we're in position getting a position of influence where you get an option put in front of us that we never had before, you know, like I said time to kill 99 scripts I couldn't do yesterday and now today you're telling me I can do all of them what well let's be Discerning and ask ourselves do not really want to do that. I know it's the first time I had the ability to or the first time it's been laid in front of me that I have the option to do that and I'm sure am
Happy about that. But before I do it, let me ask myself. What do I really want to hmm, you know for me the story about having my jeans pressed. I was so damn happy. I had a housekeeper for the first time and she pressed my jeans. I was like Wow and then I had a friend tell me. Well, that's great. If you like your jeans pressed and immediately I went. Oh shit. I don't like before we do and yes we seek relevance, but let's ask relevance for what?
Matthew you are one hell of a Storyteller. You're a fun guy to talk to some at some point. Maybe separately I'll ask you about what they put in the ground water in Texas for this Source telling because you marry car. I don't know what it is. But that's another conversation for another day. Your books official website is green lights.com. Very easy for people to remember on Facebook. You are Matthew.
On a hey Instagram official McConaughey Twitter at McConaughey and I will include links to everything in the show notes for people at Tim dot blog / podcast. So they can find everything that we've talked about. Is there anything else that you would like to say
share ask
recommend with those people listening before we come to a close
sure came from conversation Richard linklater and I were having some years ago.
Go and it came out of just a verbal ping pong that we did. But what I think is we all should could use right now and I need to remind myself of it daily, especially in these times where look it's tough and ways that ourselves that we understand sometimes we don't understand but it's tough on ways for for everybody in ways that maybe even they don't understand and we probably don't so everyone can use a little bit of amnesty right now and what I mean by that is this if you're not sure how to respond to a situation
Can you just make sense of humor the default emotion?
Can we just have a little more humor and give each other a bit of a break right now? It's tough times. Let's be for each other right now instead of against each other and sense of humor does not it does not get rid of the truth does not get rid of the problem does not get rid of the challenge. It actually reveals it sometimes in the most truthful ways. Hmm laughs the to have some humor through the tears and humor through the pain and not laugh at someone else's expense laugh at our expense all of our the human existence expense man. We're doing the best we can
And in are over not what would Let's help. Somebody try to
hear hear. Well, thank you so much Matthew. This was this is an incredibly enjoyable conversation and super
fun for me Tim. I really enjoyed it and love to do it anytime.
Yeah. Yes. I would love to do around to some time. Maybe maybe when were in proximity and Austin we can do a 20-foot social distance. So TBD but we your first book green lights is so unexpected. It is so fun.
One it is a romp through your mind a romp through the turns and twists and learnings of someone who's had an unorthodox path. And on top of that documented so much for decades. It's a rare combination. So I encourage people check it out. And for everybody listening we'll have notes to All Things. We've discussed in the show notes to not blog / podcast and until next time. Thank you for tuning in.
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