This is the grounded podcast episode 5 with that go Charles.
Greg McIntyre, great change. Otherwise known as Greg train. Yeah, Greg tray. Yep. So Greg train is long time, training partner of all of us. Well, how do you guys even know each other? Did you guys just know each other from Jiu-Jitsu? Yeah, but it seemed over some other connection. Yeah. Like Tim right, like Tim was it started like hanging out because I know you for like years and years before we, but we're like hanging out and stuff. Yeah, you know, each other pre Jujitsu. No, okay.
Met the Chula Vista Police. Yeah.
05 at what 2005, you know, that little Lavista blood when Dean was teaching in like out of a kickboxing academy for a liquor and anyone from the one the Hat will half of it. Yeah, that's when you can because there was a curtain and whatnot. But you Greg train that was not your first grappling experience.
No, I started with Bobby Santos,
but that wasn't even your first grappling
experience. No wrestling before. That was you right?
Castle. Yes. Early wrestling in junior high, how'd you get into wrestling? How do I get? I hated bike racing
bike race. Yeah, like BMX bikes
race, right? So my mom would take us both bike racing and my brother was into it. And so I had to be a new
who's older you or your
brother? My older brother. Okay, so he take me by crazy and I just kind of had to go along. Then I finally found wrestling. He try, he's resting in high school, and then I wanted to wrestle to. So I did the junior, high wrestling and I did really well. So,
When you do really well, you didn't like it. So I
stayed with her that's kind of the key with kids. You want to like, make them do well with stuff you want to let knob saying you got to let them win. But you want to let them know in the wind a little bit. You know, what the working dog? You know, I'm saying, when I say working dog, like an attack dog. Yeah, you know, for a civilian did call it attack, dog. In the military. We call it a working dog. The working dog doesn't lose any scraps. Yeah, like in training and training, it always wins and they hit it with.
Like a fake stick that kind of makes a lot of noise, but it doesn't really do anything. Is that dog thinks it can? Just when it's out there in the field it thinks he can kill any man. Yeah, things every man is a big pussy. That thing is just going to rip your face off, but the reality is like you can get offensive with a dog and you know, you can beat up a dog because the dog is just a dog. Yeah, right, but mostly, I mean, they definitely work.
So what like, where's the balance there? If they with kids?
Aids. For example, you do you want them to get beat up like 10% of the time
24/7. I think you gotta, you gotta kind of follow it. You got to ride the wave properly, right? If they're just starting to dominate then, which I think the goal is that you want to you want to, when they start to dominate and they're just feeling great. Then you just give a little a little push back down, just a little nudge back down. And they say, oh, I need to, I need to work a little bit harder. Yeah, you know, I did not do a good job of that. With that with my kids with jiu-jitsu with jiu-jitsu. It was your oh, I'm
Know what I'm going to do for my kids because I'm such a great dad. I'm going to make everything so hard that they're going to be tougher. Yeah, but really, it was like, oh Dad. You're going to put us in a compliment. I'd put them up a weight class or two weight classes. Put them up with the older kids, higher belts and they'd go to a jiu-jitsu tournament and there's a big difference between a 7 year old and a 10 year old, right? Like there's a big difference, a big difference. So I'd put my seven-year-old kid against a 10 year old kid, and he would not
He wasn't training hard, but then a ten-year-old kids tenure. That's a huge difference. Yeah, and to be all sad that he lost him. And of course I'm thinking. Don't worry. I'll make you tougher. Yeah. Hey, don't worry kid. You'll be tougher and the kids that was not fun. Not a problem. Not a lot. That's why I tell people. Now the main goal as a parent with jiu-jitsu or with anything is, make it fun. And then to your point, Greg. How do you make something fun? Mate win winning is fun. So you, you were in junior high, you started winning and there's a little bit of natural Talent. You probably read.
Round your brother had a little Edge over the other kids. So all of a sudden you're winning that makes you want to train more. When you want to train more, you win more when you win more, you want to train more. It's a good cycle to get the kids into.
Yeah. Yeah, that's interesting. You call it the
wave because if you do it too much, you don't catch the way. If you do too little you don't catch the wave, you know, you got to be so kind of money. You gotta modulate, right? You're like from Kid to Kid. It's gonna be different.
He's on the kid too, right? Yes. On their temperament.
Yeah. That's true. Some kids have the temperament. They want to go against the hardest kids and then
If you have that, then you can you can push that a little bit further. You're gonna ease towards that side. But if you have the kid, that's not like that. Then you got to back off and you just want to have fun, some kids. It's so weird. I mean, kids are just different, you know, kids are so different and you got it, you have, I mean you steer them a little bit but they just dared to go where they're going to be a certain way, you know, and you're not going to get your kid to be exactly how you want them to be. And I was, it was
Group of parents with a group of men, and everyone's talking about my kid, this, you know, didn't do this. And I said, hey who at this table? Did what your parents wanted you to do? Like in life, right? The answer is not one person. Not one person. Oh, I did exactly what my parents wanted me to do looking who says that? No one says that, you know, I guess there's some kid that. Well, my parents wanted me to go to Stanford. And so, I went to Stanford or whatever. Yeah. Well some families, they have a tradition, you know, we're like the sons,
Son of the daughter. Whatever follows in the footsteps. That's true. That's true. No, I you right now that I think now, I think about I've known some families that have family businesses. Yeah, now not every kid in the family. Will go into the family business, but there's usually one or two of them. Now, sometimes that's a, that's a smart decision. Just straight financially right there looking business, but also they get they raised with it right there. Raised with that type of business.
Yeah. I think that's it. There the expectations just kind of there. Yeah, they don't get told to do one thing or another. I remember in high school thinking like
When I was graduating some of my friends were like, oh, yeah, I'm going to go to college because it was just expected for me. Nobody went to college. So that's an interesting idea. I think about it. Yeah,
what did you do straight out of high school.
I played around in college a little bit. Like in college. I took some classes. I know what I was doing, then I started training and competing and then I was out for a while like a year and a half. For I got a bad disease in mine.
Intestines and that is serious surgery. And so I was out so
that you, wait. What did you wait prior to that
disease?
175, what did you weigh? Like after your lowest point with that disease?
I think I lost like at my worst. I lost like 35 pounds. Yeah, it was pretty
bad. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You I remember seeing you when you were sick and I was damn, all shocked bro. Yeah, as you lost a lot of weight and your and your and just so everyone knows because you're not seeing Greg train is 100% lie, like there's no there's no like fat, Greg trade, Greg. Jane is pure muscle.
So yeah, when you lost that much weight, that was a lot of weight for you to
lose. Yeah. Yeah. I know. It was a tough age to lose all that weight because I was 20 years old. I remember coming back. Like I was I was I just had caught the bug, you know, the Jiu-Jitsu bug all the dick to do it and then I wasn't able to train yet. I had like for a while. I had an ileostomy bag and all that, but I remember coming back sitting on the wall at Fabio's and watching you guys and it was just the worst few months of my life. That's what felt like
that because he got away.
You can't dissipate kind. Oh, yeah. The other thing is weird. When you get injured you feel like or disease. I assume is the same but you get injured. You feel like it's never going to get better. Yeah, it's actually the worst thing in the whole entire world and you had to bicep surgeries to Echo. Yeah. So was your second one mentally worse, or was the first one? Mentally were first one. The first one was worse. Everything. Mentally. And physically? The second one. You knew what you had. Yeah. He knew what the deal was. So yeah, I got this. Yeah.
And like I knew what I had to do for rehab and I don't know if the surgical procedure was more updated to and I had like that some supplementation to some joint Warfare. Not like nothing crazy, nothing like that. But yeah, I know it was the path to recovery. Who was way more clear. For sure. For the second one. Yeah. Did. What was the deal with that disease? Was? There? Was there a pathway to where they said you'd be like, okay, you'll be recovered from this eventually
before the surgery. Yeah.
I think they just kind of wait and see how severe it is. And then it was a it was a bad case. So like some people just live with it if it's like a mild case, ulcerative colitis what we're talking about and then they could take these anti-inflammatory medications and stuff. But for me, it was like it was really bad. This isn't all that weight and they're like, you know, choice you need to get rid of that thing. So they took the entire colon out which fixed a lot of the problem. So if some issues obviously, you need like it's going to be to have a colon
Yeah, but but, I mean, I'm, it's a lot, it's a lot better than having a disease, you know? Yeah, but yeah, there's there's people out there to have a mild case of it and they're fine, you know,
so when did you win, was that? Okay, so you started training or a Jujitsu and then how
long from the time you started trying to Jujitsu. Did you
find out that you
had? So I think I was pretty deep in my blue belt with Fabio. So a couple of years K.
Yeah, were you fighting it? Because you're in King of the cage? I
Remember I had about Gina Willie Old King of the cage video. See ya? You buy the DVD set? So sure enough. I watch that and this was like when I was like fired up to be in because I've started Jiu-Jitsu because I was going to fight MMA. So I was like, okay, you know watch all the king of the cages and Dean was on there. So I was like fired up those, get the treatment Dean and then I see him on there. I'm like, oh my gosh, my team is so awesome or whatever. Um, you seem bigger though. Okay. So the question is, was that before?
For that was in your head.
Yeah, it was, it was going on for a couple of years like, while I was competing and then I was young like what? 19 at the time and super night, even like I was just like, I'll just deal with this. It's okay you. And but that was before the surgery. Yeah, I was before the surgery so it took a while to get like as bad as it got to where I needed surgery. But yeah, I was like competing with the disease and yeah, it was rough.
You were ready for competition though.
Growling, makes you so ready for competition. Yeah, so ready for Jiu-Jitsu competition. Yeah.
It was that, that, that stage where you remember when you ride around Bluebell. You just want to compete it and if you can
yeah, that was a good time. And then how long were you out with it? I mean Attic So surgery. Boom. Alright, so I was
out for a while and
And then I had the surgery and then there was like a second part surgery where they like made what's called A J pouch out of my small intestine like make kind of like take place of the colon a little bit and then when that healed up there to go back in like connected to my intestines and stuff like that. But so I'm
just doing straight Plumbing inside. Yeah.
Yeah. In the way that they talk about it. They talk like they're plumbers. It doesn't sound like super
techy. It's weird. Some of the doctors that do like surgery.
Your bones and stuff. They're doing construction in there. They're in there with hammers and chisels and stuff. All right up. Yeah. Cause they're getting busy now. You have the plumbers in there. Yeah, putting together
piping. Yeah. I'm actually in there in the or seen this stuff weekly because I'm an X-ray tech and right and I see the orthopods got dr. Luke here, training with us. Yeah, those guys especially the ortho guys are just and the spine guys, too. But yeah, they're construction workers. They're in there hammering. Always. It's not like careful.
Surgical like that red, it's bad razy. So then when was your, when was your first fight? After you sir after you heal, after you have the surgery? How long did it take before? You were kind of? All right. I'm back in the game. Now.
Geez was at least a year and a half and then, then I kept trained you to so we'll even sure if I was gonna get back to fighting because I fought, I fought like with like, two weeks of JuJu's experience
first, like, as a wrestler. Let me
do. I do good. I have a sick. I won. Yeah, the videos.
Areas, like double leg arm bar under pound, would you
do? Yeah, so had a few fights. There is everything you get in there just like it was like old-school UFC. There's like all these different disciplines in there wasn't even MMA. Ex. I'm talking 1999. Yeah, and then, yeah. And, and so we're fighting. It was in a nightclub in San Pedro, again
soon. Yeah.
It was not even, he wasn't even legal. In fact, for sure. I was
told it's completely insane. Yeah. I was
told that
They were pretending, it was like a WWE type of thing and the results were like predetermined but really, it wasn't, but that's how they got away with like, making a fight. And then when I was 19, I was like,
whatever. Yeah, whatever. I wanna fight somebody. Yeah. So, where's your first play? I would you with?
So, I armoir this guy that was like,
from what position
from the bottom. The guy I
was on top and bottom, dude. I double leg the guy. I got to show you the vehicle, are ya. So tell me the
fight. Yeah, so I were fired doubling the guy like run them across the cage and and I
Get on top. He's super athletic strong guy. He's stronger than I, and then he ends up turning and getting on top. And then I turn for this like super sloppy, armoire. And then, and I got it. And I was going nuts. It was like because
this guy was a champion at the whole. I did he like, break your cousin's nose or
so. Yeah, he fought my cousin broke his nose before that. So I won that and I want another
fight. It's kind of super sketchy. Like I would not want to have a to
Week of Jiu-Jitsu trained, Greg train, grabbing my arm and trying to get it quite right. How hard were you go? You got a hold of that thing. I bet you would try to rip that thing off of his body as long as I can. So that was the first
fight. It was a layers. I was wearing like like biking shorts and wrestling
shoes that is old school
now and then I want another fight and then I actually the one that I lost their in those it was like this dancing.
Waters like nightclub. I then I fought again against Javier Vasquez. Oh, yeah there. Yeah. And he was a, I'll still wipe out. He's a purple about the time but I had my wrestling working formula, but he actually is a good wrestler. Also.
Yeah, yes,
but uh, I took him down and then we scrambled a little bit and then he got me this, armoire and like I pick him up just like, I'm like a deadlift and he was like, like parallel to the mat has hold him straight out. And, and then I like so.
Slam him down and I end up in a triangle and he finished me that. Yeah, but yeah, that's
dude that fighting have he Vasquez. Yeah. Back as a white belt when he's purple, but and back then a purple belt was much. But yeah, you like that was like a black belt today, you know, there were so rare.
Yeah. Yeah, no. Purple level serious.
Yeah. And how he Vasquez was running stuff on the circle, you know, he was, you know, because back that's in the time when, you know, me and Dean were competing all time, you were competing, but we'd go up to those big grappling this. And
Have you asked, as would always be crushing people those things?
Yes. He was like one of the first guys, that was at that like a high-level Jujutsu, but also had high level wrestling's and he was using it such in the right way and he was
great with tearing it out. Yeah, of
life. There's a lot of those guys now. Oh,
yeah, now it's the crazy thing is, in San Diego. In San Diego, the girl, wrestlers, almost all the good girl, wrestlers are Jiu-Jitsu originally, they're all Jiu-Jitsu gross. Well, a lot of them because jiu-jitsu,
So popular in San Diego that they just start. They start doing Jiu-Jitsu in there, whatever. They're 10 years old. They start doing Jiu-Jitsu, and then they doing Jiu-Jitsu Judo, and then they show up in high school and someone says, hey, you should wrestle and boom. There you go. And they have all that background, and there's not a lot of girls that just grew up wrestling in San Diego. So, yeah, nowadays. It's so common that people do
both. Yeah, that's crazy to start introducing, then go to wrestling. That's unheard of when I
started. Yeah, that's kind of common.
So then how many fights did you get? Did you have before you had your surgery?
Just fight random nightclubs WWE, you know,
it was it's what you're picturing right now. Yeah, like people like,
oh, yeah, you go up against this. The the cage like this is the two years that I was. This is when I left Fabio's, I was in Virginia Beach right now. So that's why, that's why I'm not. That's why I don't remember that's why I wasn't at these fights because I was in Virginia Beach from 98 to 2000. And so I wasn't here so you because I remember you and then I left and then you would fighting in nightclubs. Yeah.
Road house, then we should change is change his name from Greg train to Roadhouse.
Now. I remember that. I remember, I remember when you came back that first time in like, you must have left right? When I started.
Yeah, we're real close.
Yeah, and then I and then you came back and I knew of you. But then you showed up though. That's the guy.
And yeah, the weird thing was I was I got my blue belt pretty fast from Fabio and
Then like probably when I was starting to be like, right around. Ready for my purple belt. I left. Yeah, so I show up at my gym with Gustavo Machado out in Virginia Beach and I trained there and I trained with Frank Kruk, Frank coochie some to so, but I was trained in there but like they weren't going to give me my purple because again, back then you weren't just given away a purple belt subdued, you know, you needed you to know that dude. You need to have like a blood trust relationship. So Gustavo probably.
Me to be there for another, pretty good chunk of time, but I was only there for two years. So I train train train train and then I came back to California. So when I came back to California Fabio was looking at me. Like, I just skipped practice for two days. He was looking at me, is they who, you know, you've been skipping practice for two years. You think you're gonna get promoted, know your back at the bottom of the boot belt wrong. So I had Stripes. I was getting striped. Did you get stripes on your blue belts? No, I Got Stripes. I had forced right? I got it.
One stripe when I came back after being a flame after being a boob out for like, for like three years, I come back and Fabio gives me a stripe after like six months. It gives me a stripe on that thing. I was like, you didn't like that. Did he get then six months later. Gives me and I was ended up being a blue belt forever. Yeah, finally a guy finally. Give me my purple. Purple belt to me was kind of a big deal. That was the biggest deal to
me through. I feel like he would make people struggle for the belt more, if they were like physical.
Aggressive. You know,
what are you trying to say? Life is going to have some
experience because I came in as a wrestler. Yeah, and then and so he would like sick Dean on me
at for a sailor or Higgs.
Yeah. And just like sort of teach me a lesson. And yeah, and I love those lessons. Yeah. For sure. But yeah, he would if you're especially if you had some wrestling experience or and you were more physical. Yeah, I think he did make us wait longer. Yeah. Because
It's like he can't
just roll in here with your wrestling and think you're gonna get our best kind of thing. You know? Yeah. Yeah, I could see it. Need to get. You need to get tapped out a bunch by deed Lester. Yeah. It's like you gotta it's almost like Fabio would be like and obviously, I can't speak for him. So I don't know. But it seems like Anyway, he'd be like, like, yeah, a good good wrestling. Very effective, but I'm here to teach you Jiu-Jitsu. So I'm going to teach you some Jujitsu Dean, teach him some did you just do? And then when you learn that, okay, I'll give you your belt, no matter how effective your wrestling is time.
Normally weighed like 107. Well, by this time, he might have been heavier by this time. He might have been up to 185. But when he, I, when I started training, he was 174. And the weird thing is, I can't say he felt his heavy on top, because he didn't, but he still felt heavy, but he's still as strongly, like, young grabs you, and you just say, and this is, I can't move. He still felt like that. Even when he was 174 even, he was, and he was only 19 years old. He was a little kid.
He was freaking strong and you had the technique, you know, he had that random technique. Okay? So, how many fights did you have before you went and got
surgery? Geez? I'm trying to remember, there were a couple of those fights at the dancing waters. Clear that, that
weren't recorded. Yeah, they're just unsafe yet and they not on Sherdog.
They're so I had those and then one Gladiator Challenge and then like maybe for for the DeLaet, this the tool before my surgery, I should had no business fighting.
Did you, did you wear them or did you lose
an odd lost? I lost
Zack because you were trying to cut weight and your body wasn't getting nutrition and it was just a total disaster.
The time like the disease. It's an autoimmune disease. So sometimes it would flare up and get real bad and sometimes it wasn't so bad.
Bad. And so I would so I plan to go to like Denver for this fight for example, and I went and I was feeling, okay. And then because of the flight or I don't know what it was like like stress like sort of flares it up or something and then suddenly I'm like pulling all this blood and like, I'm flaring up from Adams, cramping up and everything.
So you should not have been fighting
and I shouldn't have been fighting it like any, my cousin was with me and he's telling me there's probably a bad idea but
Like, tiptoeing around it, you know, they're all the way out here, you know. Yeah, so I but I remember in this on video, they, I was mounted and and like is almost like someone reached down and took the batteries out of me. And I'm out in the guys looking at me. Just knowing that I'm dead like mounted and he starts punching me from the bottom line is mounted girl. Yeah, it was bad. And then I had to go to the hospital afterwards. It was I was like, I was in really
bad. Is that what made you finally decide like? Okay. I need to do something about
this. Yeah.
Yeah, I I mean, I didn't decide after that the flare up got so bad right after that fight to where I started losing weight like every day, like a little girl every day. So so yeah, they just know they admitted me in the hospital and started everything. But uh, oh, yeah, so I was able to like few years later, come back and try it again.
And when you came back, you came back, you got some good
scraps.
Yeah,
yeah. What did you record under
being? Jeez? What is it 10? And for
how many fights did you have in the
wec?
WC to fight to fight. Yeah.
Win or lose? I lost. Yeah. Thanks for bringing it up.
Very sorry, who'd, you lose? So
I lost to the first one was guiding Budnick and I was winning the fight for what, like 13 of the 15 minutes and got triangles. Like, I'm watching the guy on top and I'm guessing they're in experiencing got triangle. But yeah, so there are a few fights leading up to
That one that I won and then there was the the one that was featured on the Tapout episode and that one that's right at that one, that one sort of like pushed me into the WC, which was awesome, you know, but
for those of you that don't know that WC was kind of the lightweight UFC, not not just not meaning like lightweight UFC, but the guys that were lighter weights, they would find WC back in the day and then and then W and then UFC bottom and they started a small weight classes. Yeah. UFC, I know.
We're in the big time.
Yeah, I thought I knew what I was doing to because you know you're winning and but then retrospect like I had no idea what I was doing. That's bad that the trainings in volleyball since into the way they're doing it now. And I mean, I was barely I was in training the right way. You got a spar more all that stuff. Yeah, like I thought my boss he was decent and then looking back. It was terrible
like anything. That was cool when the tap out guys came.
Yeah, I'll tell you the
sky scrape. Actually, I put those guys both from the sea to rower. Hmm. And said, you know, this is what you should be able to do and I was kind of talking smack to him, you know? And both those guys grinded it out like their life depended on it and both of them got I don't know what they got. They both got a sub 1:30 500, which is respectable. You know, for comments, like scrape is me like you kind of thought mask would do it because he was kind of, you know,
Like in shape walking around the shirt off like Echo, does it even talking about and do that? He was kind of like that. But then also the thing is scrapes 19 feet tall, which does give you an advantage on C2 roller and punk ass. I mean, it was punk ass down here. Yeah. He was here. He I don't think he got on it. He said I'm not doing that. But yeah, then you that got you so that got you into the W. That's what did it.
Yeah. I think the exposure from that for
sure.
And then to the wec, the new you lost your fights in the wec. Yeah, it seemed like it was hard for you to to like have your energy up after you got that surgery. Is that is that a correct assessment or do you think you just trained wrong?
I probably a combination. But I mean there's a lot. I could have trained better could train harder, you know, but, but yeah, it does suck some energy out of you because your, your body.
Always sore. Even if you have like like it tooth infection, like a small one and your immune systems fighting, you have less energy for everything else, you know, so, so I think I was like, constantly sort of dealing with the inflammation process of that, and then it would, it was harder to go as hard as I wanted to go for sure. But, but there are other factors. I wouldn't blame it on the disease because the the entire colon was gone. So, the the problem,
Was removed most but there was just a little bit of it left.
And so then we're what made you decide like? All right, you know what? I don't think I'm going to fight anymore.
Dang, good
question or my last. Are you still thinking about getting back in the kitchen? And I'm washed up,
not my last bite of one. We had that fight. Were you around? It was at Camp Pendleton, you know, so I went to
them and I wasn't, I didn't go to
it. Yeah, it was been traveling a lot.
Another xwc guy, Kenneth Alexander. I fought at Camp Pendleton and I felt good started finally feeling like I knew how to fight, you know, for the first time and then I did well, armbar that guy and from what position, from the bottom.
What's up with you beat on the bottom? Yeah. It's weird. It's crazy to
me. I got on top, but I think, because I was, I was dragging, I was throwing a lot of punches and kicks and he grabbed my foot. He's a wrestler. Also. Okay, grab my foot, put me on the bottom, then I ended up getting
In an arm lock, but and then I think I plan on fighting after that, but then I had a menace corrected me on my, my knee and then another one and all this time started going by, and then like, I gotta start doing some adult stuff. Go to school, or
education. Yeah, because at one point, you ask me, you were like, hey, man, here's what's going on in my life right now. I could, I will, I could just train.
Yeah, I could train, that's it. And I'll make a little bit of money from teaching classes and just get by. Or I can go to this X-ray, tech school and become an x-ray, technician. And I remember telling you go become a to x-ray technician, not because I didn't think you could, you know, go for it in the fight world, but because even to go for it in the fight world, you can't this isn't just because you're become a fighter.
I mean your foot doesn't mean you're working out for 16 hours a day. It's not 16 hours a day of working out and now eight hours of sleep. No, that's not what happens. And I said, listen, go. There you're going to get a job in a hospital which means you'll have good medical coverage. You can work 8 hours a day because it's a pretty standard kind of job that has standard hours. So you work your eight hours a day and I said that leaves you eight hours to
train. Yeah. That's what you said yesterday. You didn't say being actually taking said, do
both.
Yeah, yeah. Said you both. Yeah, because and that's I think that's the smartest move because think about it. When you're an X-ray tech. You've got a regular income. You can buy things like food, you know, you can buy things like, wraps for your knees because, you know, I've had Fighters over the years where they been, like, I really wish I could get a knee pad, you know, keep in mind. That's most Fighters that is most Fighters for sure. Most Fighters is, hey, do you know, I saw you throwing and you need pad in the garbage?
Because it had a bunch of holes in it. Can I have that? Yeah, you can man. In fact, I'll get you a new knee pad leader. Could have won this one right here. Cause $8. Mmm, but people, yeah, man, it's a tough. Row is a tough row. There's no money in fighting, not for a long time. I mean the the amount of people in the UFC that I've actually set themselves up is tiny, tiny number of people, most people, and it's better. Now, of course, but back then.
That's why you have to start when you're young because there's, there's no there's no payoff. There's the payoff is life experience and the excitement of it. And even if you do, well, a lot of guys that do well for a while, unless they're the top guys on the billboard. They're still not making that much
money. No, same thing with boxing. It's the same. It's just you got to be the star. It's got to be the star to make money from it. How much? How are other things like that? Like, if you're going to be an
Are you think most actors are just? Yes, I think acting is another one. Oh, yeah acting is because they talked about how most people in LA or waitresses and waiters and they say, what do you do? I'm an actor but I just have to wait tables right now. Yes. That is the key. That's what is normal. Oh, yeah. I mean you figure even if even like
full-on sag actors like who
are in movie, I mean, you know, you have that upper echelon and a and b list kind of situation. And once you kind of go beyond there,
The seedless scenario oceans upon oceans upon oceans of actors if just chilling, waiting tables or whatever. Musicians, same thing. Now that I think about it right now, there's not too many musicians that are just out there raking in the money. Yeah. Yeah. In fact, most of them aren't yes,
Jordan Pederson. Talk about this in a way. He talks about the Pareto Principle or it's like, you get like and it makes sense. All these. They're all true.
Around waiting tables or bartending or something. And then, once they get an opportunity that opportunity leads to another one, which leads to five more opportunities, then then they're pushing opportunities away. So he either have nothing. Then there's some some point. There's like a Tipping Point where they have tons of opportunities.
Yeah. Well what I heard him say the other day that I thought was funny. He's like, if you're creative then you're probably poor because creative personalities are usually not people that are conscientious which means that the kind of people that are like, okay. Well I've gotten kind of her
A pair for me for the next, you know, six months financially. Yeah. Creative. People are saying I'll just make it happen. Yeah, and so the creative people are generally pours. What he's saying? Which this actually fits into this whole idea. Yeah, makes sense of what it is. So when did you get your black
belt?
Let's see.
Own. I know
he was here. It was right after your W Kissel. You did
not the WC fight. Sorry the fight
you did on the top out. Show. That was the one you won by decision. But you have that guy in the arm bar for like a long-ass time and
it just was like that was it right? That was afraid of black belt for that fight. You did. Yeah, like right before that fight. Oh, yeah.
So I read your was that
it was not 09, wasn't no
earlier. Yeah, it seems like it was earlier like I
No, thanks.
Yes, because we were all Victory opened or it was called. Throw it out easily. Yeah. In like 07. You got a black belt. I remember the first day you met, we open the doors for us in 07, but the actual official opening for grand opening was 08 was January 2nd 2008. Yes. So you must be either got it in 06 or 07 you were here. Like, we know know we had this gym when he got it, almost 100% sure. Because the day he
He rolled in, with his black belt used teaching noogie. And I wonder was that got a boxing club? Okay. Yeah. No, I've maybe you got your back brother, the boxing club and dude. Yeah. Okay. Was that the why are there we go, so then yeah. The great. I didn't like 07. You must got an 07. Dang. I only got mine in 05, so that's cool because I got my white built in 05. There you go. Joined in 05 that day when you rolled in your teaching noogie and you put on your gear,
I'm calling put on Maggie, put on your black belt and I was like, oh, I see what you did there. Yeah, I was thinking about it. I was like fry dig it because I probably would have done that thing to do because I had never seen anyone do that before and I knew you'd just in case you just not maybe not me specifically, but I'm just saying just kind of let everybody. Hey guys. I got a brown belt
anymore. I remember that story of I'm sure it's true. When I first got it. I was excited. Like that was my assumption.
Yeah. That was my assumption though.
You know, I think I actually got my black belt in 06. No yours was 052 because and it's weird more. Like, I'm the Super Fan knows whenever I know that you got yours at that time because I remember it specifically. I know you got yours in 05 because I got my blue belt in 06 and you are black belt when I started. Okay. Yes. Now that I remember it. So I was, I think I just got to Seal Team, three task unit Bruiser when I got my black belt.
A few month, that's what it was. So that was 05. Few months. Before I showed up. I had that blackmailed. You, I'm pretty sure.
But I remember getting my purple belt. I was very excited to get my purple belt and you think that that was the most exciting belt to get that way. By the time I got my black belt. It was kind of predetermined that I was you know, like whatever. I kind of felt like we will. Yeah, of course, I'm gonna get my black belt when you were when I was a blue belt. I'm thinking, well, maybe I'm not maybe I'm just never get my purple belt. Maybe I'll just be honest, this blue belt permanently.
Yeah, I think that's common. I think like there's a
Your blue belts and maybe less than half of them and purple belts. Yeah, probably was. But once you get the probability might as well. Keep going. Did you probably Addicted by then anyway, so yeah a lot of bluebells. Quit.
Okay? Yeah. That was going to ask because you don't seem like the type that would be hung up on like what my bro. But I wear my pilot all he did not care. Yeah, so and that's a strength because that's hard to type to get into mindset lies or it can just creep it. I was like that until like mid Purple belt.
Like I didn't know I was going to get a profile at least just bust it out. One day. I'm like, oh cool. I guess I'm a purple belt now, same thing with Bluebell and, you know, but do you think how you were saying like blue belts kind of get stuck in blue belt. Do you think it's because they just hit plateaus, at that time or they quit and if they quit, he's my little type offices because when you're a white belt that's essentially, like you don't have a belt, right? You just wipe out. You can literally come in the first day year, a white belt, but when you get a blue belt sick, pay me got
Color, so some people
they got they have this the payoff, you know, it's like their balloon kind of gets popped the they got their payoff and they started their just sort of less motivated now, you know, so they just sort of Fade Out, you know, I got my blue belt. I'm good.
Probably is probably a lot of reasons. It's hard to figure out like why people quit? Because they're all different. But I think when you first get a blue belt it just like your you've just started you to your wife about your your 0 built, you know, you know, nothing and
Then you learn a few things, you learn some Basics and you get a blue belt, bluebells. The easiest one to get right there. You learn some Basics and so you're still not fully in the game. You're not like fully committed mentally, but
they don't know bronze fully committed when I was a white belt for crying out loud and everything. Yeah, you're kind of you. So, that's the number for real. You said the same thing, like the minute you walked into the middle. You got armlock the first time you must have been like, oh, this is awesome. I'm gonna do. Yeah, but as far as you the same way I coach,
So you're committed but he's talking about the people who quit and up quitting. I'll actually say this. It actually this is proved kind of like a question to your hypothesis when you don't know anything, you're all amped up. That's what's weird. Is that people lose that hype? Yeah, some people lose it. I never lost it. I still like I'm amazed when I learned something new man. I went over a drill yesterday with Dean 28 times and I just couldn't believe the little details. He was telling me on this thing. Just a little, just a little coming up on the single from a
Weird little half guard position. I've been making a mistake for a long time. And and there you go. And he'd show me nine little details and then three more little details. Yeah, and I just went home thinking, man. I'm so lost. Like, I have so much work to do and I need to get so much better. You know. Well, I think I mean you're in a way like you, you're like an exception. Your and even even graduating. I think what happens is people go. Oh, I'm a blue belt. Now, I can pretty much handle. Most people, right? Yeah, how many
People do I need to be able to him? I will say this with my first interest in Jiu-Jitsu was like, well, I definitely want to do this so I can take, you know, like, Gano myself in a street fight. Well, after six months, you know, you can handle yourself in a street fight and then it wasn't about handle myself in a street fight anymore. Now, it wasn't being able to handle Dean Lester and and James Nielson and Higgs. And and correct like all those old school guys from our crew of Fabio's. I wanted to be able to hang with those guys.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean you
Like, some people are like us to where they get obsessed, you know, and we're laying in bed, thinking about it every night, when we're
doing our blocks to your old lady. Yeah, this is she
puts her hand on her hip. There's a camera.
Oh, yeah. Boom.
Yeah, but I think a lot of people I mean, I think there's any specific like preventable way to keep people from quitting. Some people just don't love it as much as we do.
Yeah, that's really it. I think it's pretty easy. This is what I think. Okay, picture this. You just
Got a random person. John Doe starts jiu-jitsu.
Brand-new, like he goes all my gosh. There's so much stuff to learn and they just starts to learn. He's, you know, his wife says, oh you're going to train tonight. Oh, yeah, I'm going to train tonight. Then you fat, then you fast forward, six months. And he kind of knows like some good stuff. He doesn't get his blue belt yet, but he's he's feeling, you know, like well I do I know pretty much the kind of the the excitement is gone and soon his wife's like, how are you going to train tonight? Cuz I really want to hang out? And he says, well, you know what? I will hang out, I'll come home.
Early bikes and he just maybe goes, he does like two rounds and he bails. Yeah, then you fast forward a year and a half. He's got his blue belt. There's not much mystery anymore. He's the learning curve. Also, write the learning curve just like lifting everyone. When they start lifting they get all jacked. They could all strong for the first time that there you get that steep curve and then all of a sudden they get to the point where the difference between, you know, benching 3:15 and bench and 335 takes a lot of work. Whereas going from from, you know,
T5 up to 225 like you can get there pretty quick. Yeah, so I think that's what happens to and all of a sudden, the wife says, you know. Hey, do you want to go out tonight? And he says, yeah, let's go out. Yeah, I don't know. I'm trying to blame all the wives out there. Sorry will sorry ladies, but you know, I know the reason I say that is because I had a lot of conversations with my wife about that over the years. You really going to train tonight. The answer was, yes. I'm really gonna try tonight. Yeah, that's what's gonna happen. But when I see like, you guys are exceptions, like, we'll just a normal person, doesn't have like Street.
Jujitsu aspirations, even if they love doing it or, you know, stuff like that. They'll go and, you know, they'll it'll be common to skip like a week of training. I'll just go one day this week. Yeah, that's like comment for a normal person. Weird. You only have no bruh. You're weird. And Greg is weird for you know, like wanting to fight and not weird like a weird person. I'm just saying you guys are different than a normal person. So it just seems like, yeah, once you get a blue about you're like, dang it. Hey, there's also like a ton of people that
Are just full-on committed to Jutsu. Let's face it. Yeah, but I dig it but let's say like you're going to a gym. Pretty much at least 50% of the purple belts are in the game. Yeah. Right in the game. Yes, sir. But that's a rare situation where you see more purple belts than white or blue belts. Usually it's all white and blue belts and then it current sorted sort of tapers off as you go
up. Well that yeah. The purple belts are the bluebells that didn't quit. Yeah, and I blew the bluebells. I quit. They're never they never be comfortable girl. So the probabilities are that. That's what
So, you know, these guys, are you
serious? There's yes, they're serious. But any but in with purple belts, there's some purple belts that are training because you know, they like it. It's fun. They know some skills, but then there's purple ones that are just many as sharp as yeah. Oh, yeah. Sharp teeth. Exactly. Yeah, and there's like there's kind of two lanes and probably more than two where yeah, that's it. You know, if you have G to aspirations, I'm a math class person. Whatever he oh, yeah, you're gonna fly through those belts. Like you ain't boom, purple Bloom. That's why I'd like yet guys won't
Guys, don't reach Purple belt in then sort of quit, they do, but it's really rare less person than brown. Belt is even more because, like, broken, guys, don't make it to brown belt and, and that, and when you think about it, that's why there's the least probably brown belt in. This is a total guess, but there's probably less brown belts than any other belt. Because once your black belt, whether you quit or keep going, there's no other. I mean, there's the red belt and all that and I get it, but let's face it. That's probably the rarest. But when you consider white to black when you consider,
It to Black, once you reach black belt, your but. You're a black belt. There's nowhere. You don't, you don't skill out of black belt. Yeah, typically, you know, so there's gonna be a bunch of black belts, but brown belt is that one that you have to be one of the elite few that stuck with it, and then sort of and you haven't made it yet. So, do you like and you just haven't made it yet. Exactly. Right. So you can skill out of that. Yeah. No, I would say the other thing that you've got supporting your hypothesis. Yes, sir. Is that? Yeah. You're a black belt forever, basically. Yeah, so anyone that gets
A black belt counts in the pool of black belts. Whereas brown belts. There's it's the smallest number of people that came through all the other ranks and haven't made it to Blackmail. Yeah. So you think are you saying that like, you're sort of elite now, so rare, your drugs here in the brush. A level are like a drag chain. And I are over here as black belt. It's kind of con run-of-the-mill. Yep, super common situation. And Elite brown belt. Anyway, is a good hypothesis. I thought. Yeah, it was good.
What keeps you going to the map Greg train?
I love, I mean, I mean, you've had a couple just
said a couple big injuries to you've had a neck injury that was pretty significant. You've had knee
surgery. Yeah, a few of them. They're all pretty minor. They're all meniscus related knee surgeries. Uh-huh, but one was a repairs like six-month recovery. And if you're listening and your doctor says, you need a meniscus repair and you guys are training. Do just to tell them. No, I just need the trim because it won't stay there.
Like meniscus, repairs are for people that have like regular activity and they're just cruising around and then it'll probably work. But if you have a meniscus repair, is where they go in there and like the torn piece, they like, so it back down and hope it stays. But if you, they don't understand, like, if you're trained Jiu-Jitsu, you, you're gonna pull the stitches right out, which is what happened to me. And then I had another one, they just ended up trimming it out, which they should have done the first time. So at when you're young enough, they want you.
Try the repair look, but unfortunately for training Jiu-Jitsu is just gonna tear out anyway, so
go straight to the trim. Go straight to the trim. What is this with the negatives? That what's the downsides of
the trim? The trim is, like, the less meniscus you have, the more chance you have to have like arthritis and stuff. It is later on when you're like 60. Yeah. So, now, since I've had three minutes gag, tamizh, I just like, I'm not going to run. I'm not a runner it which is kind of could me. I hate running
any candy.
But no, I think what you just said applies to like mid purple level to like we once you get there, it's more than just this thing you do. It's like part of your identity a little bit. Yeah, and you're not gonna quit. It's like that's not an option. Yeah, you're just getting because you love it's part of who you are a little
bit. Here's a, here's a I guess this is the point that I am thinking about the putting your ego in check because let's face it when you get back on the maps after you've been out for six months. You're not, you know,
You're everyone, you know, we always talk about how you I can't tell if I'm getting any better. That's because everyone's on the bus. Yeah, it was on that same bus, going the same direction. So you can't tell, like, man, echoing I've been training and you know, I'm just not getting any better. It's like, no, because we're both getting better, right? So what happens is when you get off that bus, you come to school, six months later. Your timing is off your conditionings off. You haven't learned new moves. You haven't progressed your game and you're gonna get beat by people that you were beating in that hurts. I I had a, my knee hurt, right?
and,
I went from my elbow being hurt to my knee being heard. There's been a not the best year as far as like getting after it in all the ways that I like to. But here's a here's a case in point of the example. So when my I hurt my elbow, I could not do overhead squats. I mean, I could not do it. My could not extend my elbow and and and do it. I just could not do it. So no overhead squats and that was a solid like five months. No overhead squats.
And then right on the tail end of like, oh, I think I can extend my hurt my knee. And so now no, no, squats, any of any kind. So the other day, I'm I said to myself. Okay. Well, you know, I can do a squat all the way. I have full range of motion. It hurts a little bit and I can extend my elbow. I'm going to do overhead squats. How was horrible? Horrible? Oh, yeah. I mean just week, you know, the mobility is not there just all those things and then I could see you know,
What I saw in front of me, I saw the Trap, I saw the trap in front of me. I saw the Trap, the Trap, the Trap is the ego that says, well, I'm just not going to do them. It's not even ego. It's like hey, I see how people end up we know. I used to be able to do this because it'd be real easy for me to say, well, you know, overhead squats aren't really that important. Like no actually overhead squats are important and and
So what I need to do, you don't need to do, put my ego in check back on the bus and get back on the bus and start with the PVC. The PVC pipe, getting that range of motion back. That's what it takes, man. That's what it takes. But it's either you. Either, you see that trap and you identify it and I see people do this all the time or you allow that trap to catch you. And when you allow that trap to catch you, you all you do. Is you just rationalize. You just rationalizing. Yeah. Well, you know,
I don't want, you know, that's not, you know, I don't need anything. Think of the million ways that you can rationalize, you know, over at squads aren't that, you do this? That's not really no. It's like overhead, squats are good for you. You have to keep doing these movements. You have to keep doing these movements, the movements that are hard to do, you have to do them, you have to do them and you have to keep moving. And so, the same thing happens in Jiu-Jitsu, right? It's real easy to go from, you know, well if I go if I'm coming back on them.
Been injured for a while. You know, you're going to get beat up, you know, guys that you have beat before that are below. You in the hierarchy of Jiu-Jitsu. They're gonna rise above you and that is enough to make some people say, well, you know what? I'm just not gonna train either. Not I trained with that person or I'm not going to train at all. Yeah. Yeah, and that's what I'm saying. You know, that's why I like Gordon Gordon tear all the time. Like he has a dinged-up neck. It's bad, but he comes.
Out he trains in, you know, he if nothing else, he drills and he goes and learns, new moves and practices other moves and you know, Gordon was it is no joke, you know of a jujitsu guy. Like if he if he wasn't going to be laid up for a while after every time he rolled his bad neck dude, you know, Jordan through, I mean, Gordan, throws all kinds of crazy Jiu-Jitsu magic again, and so that's to me. That's awesome that he says, you know what, I can't roll right now, and he I don't know if you'll be able to roll again. I don't know, but he
Can't really now so you don't to do. I'm going to do what I can. Yeah, I'm gonna do what I can and that's that takes a lot of decks your world with him last week. Was it like a live role? Was it like limited? Yeah. It was. Yeah, the limited role. So he exactly what you said though. He does what he can. So he'll be like, hey, I'm Not Gonna Roll with everyone. You know, I'm gonna grab great, someone who I trust, you know, and let them know remind them. Hey, my next jammed up. Let's do a light. Roll. Someone who can do a light roll. Yeah, which is another whole nother thing. Yeah, cuz some people they talk about relaxing but then they don't Echo Charles -
it all with. You know, I'm not relaxing gladly and even if I shall let's just go light and I don't go light. Oh that's on purpose. That's a that's a bigger strategy. Okay, then they try to give them. Give the mental game on me. Yeah. Kind of yeah, but so I think that's like my let my lesson for this this like past couple months has been just identifying that that trap is out there. It is really easy to fall into the Trap of hey make excuses rationalize.
Is an important or you can put your ego in check because that's really what it is. Oh, yeah, really Yuri. My ego going into shock staying home. I'm going to get out the PVC pipe which weighs 20 pounds. Yeah, and I'm going to start doing overhead squats again because I can either that where you go, you know, what overhead squats aren't that really have an excuse? Yeah. Jitsu is like that probably times two because you had that have that added element of like you go.
Versus ego because you're going against a person like you're doing overhead squats even at a public gym. You'll see just like, okay, maybe someones looking at me,
maybe not whatever or at your, at your
own gym. Yeah. It's like brothers. That's no factor. It's just you against you and then it's like, okay, but you have at Jujitsu you have sure other people watching. But whatever, but you have the guy you're rolling with like you ever get tap and we're talking about this today. I, if you get Tapped Out by a guy who you always tap out. That's an uncomfortable day right there. It's not good as far as feeling.
That moment. Yeah. Well, there's a lot of things that go into that of course, but I'm saying the primary feeling that you get is not good man. Like, when someone below you tops, you out, even if you're the same belt, but you always get them, you know, like they've never tapped your before and then they get you write it. It's not comfortable. It's not good. Let's face it. It sucks real bad. Yeah, but as you were talking about that story today, like I whenever I find someone that's going to be good, man. I trained with them all the time. Try and get them better. Just get me better and try and get them to tap me. That's my
oh, that's that's very Noble and very mature of you and I get it, but I'm saying and even you. But I was about to say your brain. I was about to say to you, don't get me wrong. And even, even when you said this to Andy today, like you're like, well, you know, now that now that you do you tap Jocko. So that's kind of like an orc, it happens. And so it's like jock was cool with that and even and he's like, well, no, he's not cool. Like oh no, like of course. Yeah, of course. No to just
Straight up. Never mind someone that never tapped me before. I don't like tapping. I don't like getting Tapped Out by anyone and any time, right? I understand. I think, I think everyone in judges who in Jiu-Jitsu is like cool. I got tapped out. No, that doesn't work. You're using you just lost. Yes. Okay, so great dream job, but you're with doctor just said right there, right? Like basically, I don't like to tap ever, you know, this stuff and then before that he was like, oh no,
no gives me a better training partner or whatever which is they're both True. By the way, they are, but they're one is like the hot, your higher level maturity. One is the Primal situation and I get it. But here's the thing you say. Okay, let's say Andy, he typed out the first time that was a long time ago, whatever. Now it's like if he Taps key, I was like, that's quote-unquote. Nothing new. We'll call it, will say it in those terms. Yeah. So, but as you say when he Taps you out, you're mad, you don't like that ever, right? So you're saying, yeah, and even mad.
Kind of a strong word. Yeah, I get it mad. He's like he's like, you know what I like it. Whatever. Yeah. Well, however you want to put it. I'm just saying that there's nothing. So you're saying if you tap out 2nd now and you compare that to the feeling that Primal feeling you got when he first tapped you out or when it was new you're saying that the same. Are you saying that the same knowing? No? No, the first time was worse right? For sure. Okay. So for sure, and that's the point, that's exactly what I said today. What I said today was when, when you tap, someone out for the
First time ever that person. You like crossed into a new boundary. Yeah, you crossing the unknown. Yeah, because you never tap that person. Think about that. Think about how much you roll with someone and you could never tap them. That's that's kind of crazy. I don't have to think about that in reality. But you know everybody please please carry on. But you what I'm saying? One day you're going to tap me out and you're going to be like you're going to feel like that's going to feel good and I'll be like well damn that was you know,
Then, there's the other thing that we talked about today to is.
Let's face it. If you tap me out one time you would immediately be like, okay, that might enter the yeah, but over time if you started putting the pressure and then all of a sudden you start, you know, you could you could definitely equalize, right? You could equalize were like, well, we're pretty close, you know, that can happen. Yeah, but the thing that's cool about when you get Tapped Out by someone, is it old for me? This is my ego is now, your ego gets submitted. Yeah, and so now like as soon as you know, and he's the best example, because he's the guy that's really like,
Come the furthest against me. Other people are just straight better than me like Dean. But you know for Andy and I will say this, I saw with Dean to like when I started occasionally catching Dean Dean started to be more open and more. Yeah, you know train more loosen that was a long time ago. But yeah, you know, once once like like one day, you're going to tap me out and then you're gonna say, oh wow, jock was game is like, pretty wide open because I'll be doing more stuff, taking more risks and stuff like that, because right now, you haven't and
So, I don't want to give up that little something, right? Yeah, you know, so it's that's my ego, you know, and it sucks, but that's just the reality of it. The thing that's cool about it, is, it makes you like, makes you go like a little harder, right? Makes me go hard. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, there's let's face it. There's some days you come in and you're like, you got the look on your face, the today's the day, some days, the big de Vargas every day. Okay. I know it's late. But but there's some days where you believe that. Yeah, you have something Greg Shane showed you something.
I showed you something. You're like today's the big day. Got that one movie, It's Gonna Change everything but that's so true. Like with like if you there's actually a lot of a lot of things that you taught me specifically to do against him. Yeah. Yeah. Varying levels of success with those ones. But yeah, still not ultimately successful. Nonetheless though. Yes, but here's the thing. There's and that I think that's a common thing though. We're you know, like guys coming up or whatever and then they have that one or two guys in the gym where it's like, I just never can tap.
That guy out like they're just and if I ever do, it's a and it has a lot to do with their relationship to just like some Styles. Yeah. Yes Styles is for schools. I do some, I do better get some people than I do against other people who do better against other people that I do better against them. Yeah, there's definitely some style mixes that that play into the whole situation. Yeah, but like there is far as relationships go to kind of like, how you mentioned. How it's like, you know, sense for lack of better way of putting it might your record against me is perfect. You have
Like a million to endow. I whatever the the winds are the losses, are it at 0? So either you're undefeated, are you not undefeated? So, the fact that you're a quote-unquote undefeated, that's something that's an additional thing that you don't have. That's our relation Jujitsu relationship, part of it, part of the big relationship, whatever. So you have that, so there is motivation in you whether it be immature, mature ego, but whatever your color, but it's the motivation in you to protect that element of immature.
ER, it's ego, and it's renovating their oil and it's and it's not like you'll be like I shouldn't do that. Let me take more risks and let Echo top me out. Like, I don't see that happening. Sure could whatever. But I don't see that happening. And that's to me, that is part of the whole game. Yeah, that's part. And that's what I mean, when, when we can depend on to people's relationship and not necessarily whether their friends are not friends. I'm just saying there, dude. It's a relationship where it's like, if this guy's never tapped me out ever, ever, like there's something additional
No, in that relationship, think of how many times we've rolled. That's a lot of roles.
So psychologically because not only are you wanting to keep the perfect record, going mean extra stingy, but like, when you end up tapping in one day or went like a first time you tap me, so, I was ahead of you for a long time and then you catch me one day and then your mind is opened up like, yes, I did it once now, it's possible.
Yeah, that's what you're saying. And honestly, I
think, I think the roles are different like, after that moment. You're like, yeah. Now that he
realizes, it's
And so now they're more aggressive just more confident. Yeah.
Yeah. I look at it to from the, from the year point of view. Like when Echo Carter for the first time then it's like okay that I don't know that, that that yeah, you don't have the perfect thing is there, right? So it's like, okay cool, you know, and for from your perspectives like okay, I'm going to try this because I wouldn't really try it because it's a little more risk. And next thing, you know, you have a bet you're gonna have better roles because there's they're more food. And actually now that I think back,
The one of the reasons that Dean got so good is like once I I mean, I probably tap them out like when when he was a purple belt like like caught him in something whatever. But like the after that he was just so wide open he would try the craziest things and he wouldn't care if I caught him. It wasn't no it wasn't a big deal. And so I think that's the ultimate way to progress is as kind of the way I roll with Andy now to like we're just going for stuff and again,
Take huge risks item if I get tapped. I don't, it's not like I go cool. You tap me know, I go. Oh, that sucked whatever, you know, but if it's not that big of a deal, you know, and you you get more out of the training, like an
hour later, it's not that big a deal in the drive home. You're thinking about you. Like, am I getting
worse? Yeah. No man, trust me. No, you're right. Like, you have some tough Drive homes. If you, if you if you'd add to your point Echo. Sometimes you get Tapped Out by someone. You're like, man, like that shouldn't happen.
Happen. What? I do wrong. What am I even doing? Well, meaning, what? Maybe I should just work on my pistol. Pistol rifle shooting Qualls, right? This is keep that stuff up to speed because it's kind of what the funny thing. I want to know. The funniest thing about this whole conversation is, I'm the guy that tells people like, oh, what should I do? But you just do. Hey, put your ego jacket just, you know, enjoy it. And I'm clearly I'm saying freely that it's hard to put that ego in check. Is it,
would you?
Would you say there's any value to Ego and Jiu-Jitsu like in the negative way? Like like, obviously, obviously, we want to keep our ego in check for all these important reasons, but the competitive people the people that are always trying to win are getting better faster. And if you have any like, you're stingy
about it, nobody goes, definitely good. You need to have, you need to have some ego for sure. Because if I didn't have any ego then I first of all, I wouldn't even be here. I won't even be here because he
What
makes you want to come back and learn how to win? You know, man. The first time that I ever got tapped out from Jiu-Jitsu, I was like, okay, I need to learn whatever that is because this is the most horrible thing ever to have somebody, able to dominate you like that, that that's never going to happen. I hate that. I was pure ego. If I didn't have an ego. I would have thought to myself. Well, I guess that guy stronger than whatever, you know, like I don't
care. No, you don't try to get rid of your ego. You just keep it in.
Check. You got to keep the ego in check. If you don't have your ego in check. They know. There's another thing like we were talking about today.
Like, if you caught me, you'd be like, let's shake hands and roll again. You wouldn't like be like, yeah, finally, and I've seen people do that on the mat. I've seen people go. Yeah, you know, like all celebratory because they tapped out there friend, you know what I mean? And you got it. That's not cool. Like that's, that's just offensive. Yeah, so man, just relax. Like, you know, the United States is the all the time.
Also this do right. It's like hey Jiu-Jitsu works. If you do a Jujitsu move to me and I don't defend it. It's going to work. I'm going to tap out. That's what happens with Jujitsu. Yeah, you know the ego here's where the ego gets hurt is. If I go, well, you know, I'm not going to Tap The Echoes camera. So I'm just going to get my shoulder ripped apart. Right? No, like Jiu-Jitsu works. You make a mistake, your teammate capitalize on it. You're going to get tapped out. That's the way it is deal with it and you'll ask the way life is to. That's the way life works.
You're not going to bat a thousand man. It's not going to happen. Unless you don't get into it. Like I could stop rolling to you right now. Echo, echo, you will never catch me. Cool tears. I'm never going to roll through again. Yeah, that would be the weakest approach ever. Yeah, you know, in still ego, by the way, like how you're saying? Yeah, keep it in check. It's more like, if you can control it and almost like harness, it really in a way where you have these guys have big Egos and they get good fast because they're like, real competitive. They don't like to lose it, whatever. But it's like that ego.
Driving them to do that. They're going like forward in the right
direction. As far as, you know, learn
Jujitsu in competing a lot of time, but at the same time, if you let the kind of the ego control you it can do. So we're do things to you to like literally you can be going to jiu jitsu and your ego can just tell you don't go to Jutsu no more. Just like that example because I don't want to get Tapped Out. You want to get tough time? Got that? Yeah. That's I hate that. Oh, yeah. I hate that. I will beat myself to. I will beat that attitude into submission. I will beat myself in the submission of like, oh, you do.
Do you think you can avoid training today? You know, you when I hear that little voice in the back of my squad, you know, you got jet lag. If you go, you might get caught. I go. Oh really? You need to shut up. And here's the thing, what, I think the way I comp combat that attitude is I, if you don't go, you're taking a step back. That's that scares me more than anything like, oh, if I don't train right now, that means I'm going backwards. So learning lies, and yeah, learning technique timing.
Deal, so if I say, oh, I look at it every if I don't train, I'm if look, if I go and train and I get beat cool. I'm at least, like making progress on the mountain. Yeah, you don't even go to the mountain right now. It's not just that you don't show up the amount. You're going backwards. The the goalposts are moving. That's the important thing. Like the bus is moving your, if you're not, if you don't even get on, you might get on the bus and get bullied a little bit least, you're on the bus, but if you don't get now, if you don't get on the bus today because you don't want to get
bullied. That's okay. So you made that decision, you feel, you might feel a little better about it today because you get bullied then you then what happened is the next time you show up. All the bullies are a little bit stronger than you are, especially if you don't go on the bus for a week. Two weeks, three weeks. I look at every day that I don't get on the bus. I know what's happening, dude, and I don't like it, so get on the bus, but that's how they're right where that the you end up there and we know, you know, some of our good friends ended up there.
Where it's like people off the bus. And now it's like men you gotta get back on that hostile bus and it's even more hostile. Yeah, that's a good place is getting more hostile all the time. So you think I'm come getting on the bus tomorrow more hostile than today and I've even gone. Today. I'm not getting on to Mars, to be more hostile than guess what? The buses even a mile further. Now, more Hassan. Are you going to go the next day on the bus now have knives. Stab you in the neck, big time. So at the end of the day, you're never getting on the bus, it's just too far. It's down the street in.
If you do, you're gonna have to get on there and have to scrap back to position your. I've got the PVC pipe out. Yep. It's are going back up the hill. Yes, that's the way it works. And becomes
so obvious that ego is the only thing keeping you from there. You could only make other excuses for so long and then after all those go away like six months down the road. Okay? Why aren't you here anymore? Yeah, cuz I'll be very
uncomfortable. Yeah, buddy tap me. It would to ask. Everyone's looking at was making this big deal out of it, even though they're like, we're totally not like flickers like our
Who will remain nameless even though we talked about them all the time on here. He like he'll be like, oh, yeah. Yeah, he'll say that like, oh, yeah people, you know, till they won't respect my digits or something. He didn't say those words, but it's kind of like, that's kind of what it is, but that no one cares, no one cares about that stuff or whatever. You lost a step because you've been out for years. Oh, we don't not only does, no one care. We kind of like, that's kind of to be expected. And that happens to all of us, kind of think. We'll make a bigger deal in a positive way.
Way that he's there more so than any shortcomings that he may have developed, you know, so it's like man, it's all upside for you coming aside from that long.
So true. Nobody cares.
Oh,
that's interesting. This person is a purple belt. They suck now and yeah, they'll get they'll get over it. By the time they get home. They have their own lives to think about. Oh, yeah, they're not thinking about it. No, because it's not even close to good enough reason for you not to show up. And yes, it's not even close. That's all I mean.
The true generally to just in life like you whenever you have that feeling, you should train yourself like that. You're talking. Yeah. Get that feeling that uncomfortable, feeling. That should be like a trigger to do that.
Then the biggest trigger for me to do is the feeling of. I don't want to do it that to me says, oh as you have that same thing with working out, you know, like I always look at working out. Like if you missed a workout you don't get to make up the work out. That thing is gone. It's gone. You never give it if you miss a training session of jujitsu, it's gone that bus.
It further those people, those kids on that bus got stronger and you didn't
have that conversation with Jade actually your brother where I invited him to speak at a class. I was taking anyways, and then he's like, yeah, like right away. He said yet and then he told me later that he had a conversation later and maybe was right. Then. Anyways, you saying like a he felt uncomfortable for about a split second. He said, but he's already sort of had that.
Like in the past where it that moment, he feels uncomfortable, you know, he needs to do that. You don't want to you don't want to say no or make excuses because just going to eat it.
Yeah, we're here. We've been kicking it for like a little over an hour. I think the message of the day is get on the bus. Keep training. Greg. Do you got any social media?
Yeah, you need to make it like a Greg train at or whatever. Yeah, I need to embrace it. What do you
have at Gregory McIntyre?
Is that for? That's Instagram? Yeah. Okay. Say it again. Spell
it Gregory McIntyre, Gregory McIntyre's. MC int y re that's my Instagram. And I think it's the same. Yeah. The same for but Twitter I just kind of like
yeah Cruise some people are are leaving Twitter.
The bus is leaving them. If you want to talk to Echo. He's at Echo. Charles. I'm a chocoholic if you want any Jiu-Jitsu stuff.
Or supplement stuff, go to origin Main.com. And if you want to check out a different podcast that we have it's called Jocko podcast and go to Jocko podcast.com. You can get stuff from Jocko store. If you want us to keep doing this. That's all we got. Go. Get on the bus. Everyone will talk to you later. How
